# Nobody can solve this puzzle



## chesss (Feb 17, 2008)

Open challenge being issued..  anyone who can solve this puzzle,  is god!
Its a Chess problem.
 White to move and mate in 2 i.e first white moves then black plays and then white should be able to checkmate on the next move. 
I tried it for  1/2 hour before giving up and looking at the solution


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## Hitboxx (Feb 17, 2008)

Er, bring the Elephant(Fortress) down and issue check, then put the Camel(Bishop) into place and issue checkmate. (..figured it in two min..)

*www.imgx.org/pfiles/5282/result.jpg​


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## amitava82 (Feb 17, 2008)

Edit: Looks like its not possible.


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## subratabera (Feb 17, 2008)

But Black is not checkmated yet. It can move the rook to B5 to prevent the checkmate and check White's King.

Think.


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## d1g1t (Feb 17, 2008)

yep


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## FilledVoid (Feb 17, 2008)

Please Delete this post  .


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## amitava82 (Feb 17, 2008)

Me working too...


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## FilledVoid (Feb 17, 2008)

OK finished picture. 

*Things to note. *
1. 3 for Mate is pretty easy . 
2. Moving the Queen opens up more Escape places for the King and lengthens the game.
3. Do not move the bishop unless you want to unpin the Rook which will become a thorn and lengthen the game. 
4. You need to maintain Perpetual Check for this to end fast. 
5. Theres only one Escape square for the King as of such you need to prepare for it and make sure you dont Stalemate it. 

*Solution below. *
*img148.imageshack.us/img148/677/39377786vx0.jpg


1. As of such the King only has one Legal move. Hence maintaining that lets use the underutilized Rook. Rook to D8 (Rd8) . You just know that the King is going to move there hence remove himself from the pin on the rook and making it able to move. This must be stopped. 

2. The King moves to d3 (Kd3) . Only legal move possible. 

3. Knight to c5 (Nc5). Mate! Theres no where the King can go and the Rook cant cut the Knight since it is pinned down by the White rook. Please note that Ne5 will not mate. 

Sorry for the bad picture . Im not good at drawing  . Please ntoe that I'm no Chess God and I'm looking forward to play with all of you  .


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## amitava82 (Feb 17, 2008)

*i173.photobucket.com/albums/w55/amitava82/chess.jpg

Edit: Sh!t u r fast...


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## chesss (Feb 17, 2008)

wow 2 of u were able to solve !! 
I promote you to the level of mini-god 

for advanced god level try the next one.. I am stuck on it, even concluded that it cannot be done  . Haven't looked at the solution though
White to play and mate in 2

*img215.imageshack.us/img215/6356/chess2wj7.png


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## FilledVoid (Feb 17, 2008)

Yes. Nice puzzle. The key theme to note here is the escape square d5. 

*Things to Note: *
1. Knight is pinned
2. King can't move anywhere
3. If you move the Rook the horse is free and you lose the 2 Mate chance. 
4. If you move the white Knight  you allow for more escape routes. 
5. If you move the pawn or King then you obviously lose a coin or add to the 
escape routes. 

By now Im sure you've all noticed that the Queen would be a great start point.

Below are the steps. 

*img81.imageshack.us/img81/3682/chess2wj7ql4.jpg

1. White Queen to a8 ( Qa8 ) . very nice one. Usually everyone never looks far into the diagonals. 

2. As you can see White is in a fix. He can only move two coins. Either the bishop or the Pawn. 

3. If you move the Bishop then queen goes to a2 ( Qa2 ) checkmate, else if the pawn moves then the Queen goes to g8 ( Qg8 ) and again its mate.

PS : Yes and I know my GIMP skills suck  . Oh by the way if you all are interested in Chess puzzles Id be happy to post a few from here and there


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## chesss (Feb 17, 2008)

@exx you toh  total god ho re! 
and you may be interested in freechess.org for online chess
I managed to figure out the solution as well but it took me like an hour 

huge collection of chess problems in  pdf format and pgn and pdb format .


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## FilledVoid (Feb 17, 2008)

Don't read problems. Learning that way really doesnt help alot. Look up old games. You can find tons of old games with reviews and commentaries. If you have Chessmaster or Fritz I believe there is a Game database. understand why they moved a piece a certain way etc. What they look for in any board position. etc.


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## chesss (Feb 17, 2008)

Can you give a link? I can find lots of pgn of old games but none that come with commentary/comments


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## FilledVoid (Feb 17, 2008)

Sure for starting how is this. *en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_famous_chess_games


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## chesss (Feb 17, 2008)

*www.freechess.org/Ladder/games.html - not games by top players, but well commented


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## FilledVoid (Feb 17, 2008)

Well if anyone is interested heres a puzzle.This is from the Nunn's Collection. An excellent collection of puzzles to play with. They say that most of them is advanced but some are kind of easy. 

*Quiz 1:*

*img176.imageshack.us/img176/6839/euwe1ij0.jpg

White to play and Mate in two  .


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## chesss (Feb 17, 2008)

*Solution for the above..*

Qd6


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## FilledVoid (Feb 17, 2008)

Yup most people shy away from the thought of sacrificing the Queen. Good one .


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## subratabera (Feb 17, 2008)

That was easy...

*img215.imageshack.us/img215/1708/euwe1ij0aj7.th.jpg

EDIT: Too late...


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## FilledVoid (Feb 17, 2008)

*Quiz 2*

*img443.imageshack.us/img443/1738/nunn2lm6.jpg

White to Mate in 2


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## chesss (Feb 18, 2008)

I saw the above puzzle 2 days ago. I gave up without even trying. The solution as I later saw was indeed as riduculous as I thought it would be . I mean how cld even make such a puzzle??

@exx btw were you able to solve it??


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## FilledVoid (Feb 18, 2008)

Ive pretty much done all of Nunns puzzles  . You should see the harder ones like those above Mate 3 etc.

Hint: The solution is to create a new mate by opening up a square while not easing the pressure on the King


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## chesss (Feb 18, 2008)

I can barely do mate in 2 problems  mate in 3 would come later


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## legolas (Feb 18, 2008)

The king is stale in the position. So we just have to make a move to force black to put his pieces elsewhere.
But, this is really good. took me lots of time to figure out all the possibilities.

After white makes say Rh1, 

Black can make
1) B*C7 then, Rh4#
2) C3, then, Nd3#
3) If either of the bishop comes in e-file, then, e3#
4) If bishop comes on f-file, then, Qf5#
5) If Re7 or Rf6, then, Rh4#
6) if Rf7, then, Nd5#
...
...
The king is fc*ked!! there are more cases which are obvious.

legolas


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## FilledVoid (Feb 18, 2008)

I'll post a question a day if possible  . If someone else does it then I'll postpone it for the next day. So keep the scenarios coming. As you probably guessed I love chess . 

I'm not sure if this is supposed to go into gaming but if it does then I would definitely appreciate if anyone did. I think it might get a wider audience? Never thought that there was alot of Chess players in this forum  .


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## praka123 (Feb 18, 2008)

very interesting;but my knowledge of chess ~=0  BTW,can king can kill the near enemies?I mean in the just near squares (sry for dumbo questions )

gonna start playing with computer in gnome-chess or 3D chess


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## legolas (Feb 18, 2008)

@Praka123,  Yes, King can kill anyone (except the opponent king) who is in the immediate adjacent positions. The kings cant be in the immediate adjacent position. So, the possibility doesn't arise!

@exx_2000, may be we should play sometime!


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## praka123 (Feb 18, 2008)

@legolas:thx


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## FilledVoid (Feb 18, 2008)

> very interesting;but my knowledge of chess ~=0  BTW,can king can kill the near enemies?I mean in the just near squares (sry for dumbo questions )



The King can move or Kill anything in adjacent squaes provided it doesn't put him in Check on Capture . An important concept in the End-Game is to have an active king. In the end game the King is usually regarded as the powerful piece. (Since the Queen usually won't be there in the end game) 



> @exx_2000, may be we should play sometime!


Sure but Im really just a beginner at Chess so I might not be enough competition for you  . 
Anyway heres todays question 

*Quiz 3*

*img524.imageshack.us/img524/9612/nunn3ha1.jpg

You know the drill! White to Mate in 2 .


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## legolas (Feb 18, 2008)

Qa2  I have got this one b4 I guess...


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## FilledVoid (Feb 18, 2008)

Yup Qa2 works.


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## pree@blueshift (Feb 18, 2008)

plz delete dis post asap !!!!!!!!!!


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## chesss (Feb 18, 2008)

y r there so many 'delete this post' in this thread ??


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## FilledVoid (Feb 18, 2008)

Here comes another one. 

*Quiz 4. * 

*img238.imageshack.us/img238/8963/nunn4ob9.jpg

This one is cool. I found this question very very interesting . Oh and WHite to Mate in *3*  .

PS : Im online now if you want to play Chess. I have enough time for a game or two.


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## FilledVoid (Feb 19, 2008)

Including a hint now. 

Hint : Look for amazingly ridiculous moves. In other words its a vmoe thats not very obvious .


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## chesss (Feb 19, 2008)

Nxg3?
edit: nope
Ng5?


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## FilledVoid (Feb 19, 2008)

Nope


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## chesss (Feb 19, 2008)

I give up..


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## FilledVoid (Feb 19, 2008)

Will post solution in the evening . Keep on trying. Its an excellent question.


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## Who (Feb 19, 2008)

Here are the possible two sloutions i can come up with , tell if they are correct or not

*img110.imageshack.us/img110/3120/nunn4ob92qx3.jpg

*img512.imageshack.us/img512/971/nunn4ob91hs5.jpg


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## FilledVoid (Feb 19, 2008)

I doubt it is. But Im not sure which moves you are playing first  . If you numbered it I could probably confirm if theres another way. But its definitely not the solution I have.


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## Who (Feb 19, 2008)

Ok listed steps in this pictures, also post your sloution, 

*img147.imageshack.us/img147/8729/nunn4ob92fk2.jpg

*img149.imageshack.us/img149/8518/nunn4ob91vy3.jpg


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## FilledVoid (Feb 19, 2008)

First solution wont work cause you forget that the Black bishop can block the alst check by moving it right in front of it . 

```
Bxe8+         Kxe4          
Bg6+          Kd4           
Rf3+          Be5
```

Second Solution won't work cause you don't have a check which would mate the king at this point. 


```
Bxe8+         Kd4           
Rf4+          Kd3           
Rxa2           ?
```

*Solution*
If you've been looking for use of those discovered checks using either Rooks or Bishops your intention is good but you won't be able to mate in 3. I order to do that as I said you need to look at a very ridiculous move. 

*img262.imageshack.us/img262/5669/nunn4lc0.jpg


Theres a numerous amount of moves the opponent can make however they all end up in the same place. Checkmate within 3  . Post your move list if you have a question. Otherwise its workable from here.


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## chesss (Feb 19, 2008)

wtf?
I thought of Ke2(threatening Ke3), even posted the solution. Then saw f1=Q+ leads to an unescapable double check. So I deleted my post..

1. Ke2 f1=Q+ , Kxf1 Rf2+  - no mate here
2. Ke2 f1=Q+, Ke3 Qe1+ - no mate here...

Edit: okay figured it out. 
2. Ke2 f1=Q+, Ke3 Qe1+ , Be2++ 
Or 2. Ke2 f1=N+, Kd3 .. leads to mate


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## FilledVoid (Feb 20, 2008)

Lol I told you the solution wasn't one of the sanest moves. In the beginning no one would let the pawn go through to get queened  .


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## FilledVoid (Feb 20, 2008)

*Quiz 5* 
 OK lets look into a bit longer questions  . 

*img205.imageshack.us/img205/5348/nunn5nh8.jpg

Mate in 4.


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## legolas (Feb 20, 2008)

Well, I seemed to have missed some action out here! 
h7 is the only best move at this point and its obvious coz the king is also forced to move.

but, i see 5 moves max,
1) h7 Kg7 2) h8Q+ Kg6 3) Ncd5 Kf5 4) Qe8 Kg5 5) Rh5#

??
Is there any other possibility *forcing* the opponent king to check mate in 4 moves??


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## FilledVoid (Feb 20, 2008)

Yes you can *forcibly * make a mate in 4  . Keep on trying !


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## FilledVoid (Feb 23, 2008)

It doesnt seem that anyone is interested  . Oh well the answer starts by moving Knight to B1. You can easily calculate the rest.


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## legolas (Feb 24, 2008)

You are *Wrong* I guess.
Let's see:
The *black* king is stale.
In reply to move 1) Nb1 *c3* is the only possible move.
White makes 2) Rg1 (only possible relevant move I could think of).
For which 2) Rg1 *c2+* is the reply.
Now comes the beauty...
if 3) Kd2 or 3) Ke1, then Black responds *c1Q+* if 3) Ke2 then *c1N+* 
followed by,
4)Ke3 Nd3 5)Rg8#

So, I guess its not 4 move move by *forcing*.
I meant the bold letters for better significance sake alone.


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## FilledVoid (Feb 24, 2008)

> You are Wrong I guess.
> Let's see:
> The black king is stale.



You need to look deeper. 



> In reply to move 1) Nb1 c3 is the only possible move.



Yes very true. The reason you are not opening the path for the King is that it will throw away any chances of mating in four. 

Here are the moves. 

```
Nb1     c3
```

Moving the Knight is a must since the King is boxed in. 


```
Ke2     c2
```

You are moving the King for two purposes. First to prevent it becoming check on next move and two to give the Rook access to the horizontal row. 


```
Rc1     c2xb1
```

This is the fun part. You see its not stalemate. The pawn can still take the Horsie and promote to a queen or whatever. However it does not give him a check on promoting and hence You are free to move whatever you want. If you cut the queen your dead. Its a stalemate. But if you play the next move the game is over. 


```
Rc8
```

Checkmate. This is a *Forced* Mate in 4 moves.


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## legolas (Feb 25, 2008)

exx_2000 said:


> ```
> Rc1     c2xb1
> ```
> Checkmate. This is a *Forced* Mate in 4 moves.



Ok now, you *are wrong*.

As Black, I wouldn't play c2xb1. I would promote the pawn to *Knight* to give a check... It extends the play by 1 more move. I already indicated it in the last reply. Read it carefully and analyze it. You *Can not* force mate in 4 moves. The white king is susceptible to check by the pawn promotion either to queen or knight where ever he goes...!!


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## FilledVoid (Feb 25, 2008)

> Ok now, you are wrong.
> 
> As Black, I wouldn't play c2xb1. I would promote the pawn to Knight to give a check... It extends the play by 1 more move. I already indicated it in the last reply. Read it carefully and analyze it. You Can not force mate in 4 moves. The white king is susceptible to check by the pawn promotion either to queen or knight where ever he goes...!!



Unfortunately , you are wrong. 

Read the move correctly. Draw it on a paper and you will see that I am right. This is a *forced* mate. The rook is in front of the pawn. The only LEGAL move you have is to take the horsie. I shall illustrate it with pictures below . 

I will post screenshots from my Friends laptop . Right now Im on Linux and its hard to do it in Gimp for me. 


*Original Position*

*img205.imageshack.us/img205/5348/nunn5nh8.jpg

* Step 1.*
*img244.imageshack.us/img244/1768/step2nn6.jpg

*Step 2. * 

*img244.imageshack.us/img244/1830/step3vk4.jpg

*Step 3 * - (White only moved in the picture. Now its Blacks move) 
*img352.imageshack.us/img352/7990/step4ln0.jpg

Once the rook is in front of the pawn the *ONLY* move you have is the Pawn to Take the Horse. Next move Rook all the way to the Kings row which checks King. Game over. This is a *Forced* Mate. The reason I call it Forced is cause once I play the opponent has no alternative but playing the moves I listed above.


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## legolas (Feb 25, 2008)

I just played the position in Fritz 11. It couldn't find a solution in 4 moves...
Just tell me this... Nothing else is necessary...

Instead of playing c2xb1 in your moves, why shouldn't I play c1N+??


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## FilledVoid (Feb 25, 2008)

How can you play C1N+ ???? Theres a rook in front of it. Pawns can only capture *Diagonally*. 

c2xb1 Means Coin on c2 moves to b1 by capturing whatever is on it. I havent written the full algebraic notation since I don't know what coin the person wants to promote his pawn to. 

You cannot play c1 since pawns can only capture diagonally. DId fritz let you capture c1 while rook was in front of it? Cause if it is you should report the bug. Pawns can only capture diagonally. The only exception is en passant and that too captures daigonally.


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## legolas (Feb 25, 2008)

I got it!!  Sorry for the misunderstanding. I dint think about the possibility of RC1!! Great one.


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## FilledVoid (Feb 25, 2008)

Glad you liked it.


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