# Nvidia GTX 460 Discussion



## mukherjee (Jul 23, 2010)

Hi friends, I am back after a long hiatus. Attending to patients is taking up the major share of my time nowadays.

And mods,please forgive me for starting a new thread....I jus had to start one.

Well, its been 2 years since I bought the Palit Radeon HD 4850 512 MB card,and its served me well over all this time...and frankly,I was eyeing the HD5000 series for quite sometime now....but prices remained rock steady over the months....and along came the Nvidia GTX 460!

Well,I just bought a Palit Nvidia GTX 460 1GB Sonic card from MD Computers in Kolkata, for around 14.9k (yes,I know i paid abt 1k premium  ,but I got the card within 1 week of launch!!  )

Lets see some pics....shall we? 

*1. The Front of the pack*

*img269.imageshack.us/img269/6598/dsc012921280.jpg




*2. The back of the pack*

*img514.imageshack.us/img514/2725/dsc012941280.jpg




*3. The card front*

*img834.imageshack.us/img834/7758/dsc012971280.jpg




*4. The card back*

*img153.imageshack.us/img153/8558/dsc012981280.jpg




*5. The outputs*

*img541.imageshack.us/img541/6900/dsc013061280.jpg




*6. The VRM side*

*img30.imageshack.us/img30/3485/dsc013091280.jpg




*7. The GPU Voltage Regulator OnSemi NCP 5395T*

*img339.imageshack.us/img339/2236/dsc013011280.jpg



*8. The Fermi GF104 is visible,isnt it?*

*img191.imageshack.us/img191/1609/dsc013111280.jpg




*9. The memory Samsung K4G10325FE-HC05 chips (8 total) rated @0.5ns *

*img299.imageshack.us/img299/1557/dsc013241280.jpg




*10. The GPUZ info screen shader count is reported wrongly....for now*

*img195.imageshack.us/img195/2672/gpuzinf.jpg




*11. The GPUZ temps...The card appears cool....and the fan isnt audible at idle speed*

*img248.imageshack.us/img248/5567/gpuztemp.jpg




*12. Lastly, a GPU Caps screenie *

*img443.imageshack.us/img443/9499/gpucaps.jpg




I'll be back with benchmark results later....

Guys...please keep this thread lively....


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## asingh (Jul 23, 2010)

What are your memory temperatures. They seem passively cooled..?


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## mukherjee (Jul 23, 2010)

Yes,u noted right...but how to measure the memory temps? Any idea? 

Also,which is a better indicator of load temps..... Furmark or MSI Kombustor??


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## coderunknown (Jul 23, 2010)

@mukherjee, congrats buddy. 1k premium but you got no carry charge & as you got it locally, if some problem arises you can directly contact them. 

but 1 bad thing i seen in this Palit card is the panel. it got too less exhaust holes. so have a good cooling (ventilation) inside cabby else heat may rise up.


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## Deleted member 26636 (Jul 23, 2010)

if there is any way to measure power consumption...can you tell me your idle & peak power usage?


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## mukherjee (Jul 24, 2010)

Sam.Shab said:


> @mukherjee, congrats buddy. 1k premium but you got no carry charge & as you got it locally, if some problem arises you can directly contact them.
> 
> but 1 bad thing i seen in this Palit card is the panel. it got too less exhaust holes. so have a good cooling (ventilation) inside cabby else heat may rise up.



Thanks buddy....Yes,support...thats more important to me than price...isnt it?
Yes,the vent's a bit of a problem...but worry not,my case ventilation is optimized,by 2 80mm fans and a CM 120mm fan  !!



himadri_sm said:


> if there is any way to measure power consumption...can you tell me your idle & peak power usage?



Well,I dunno how to  
Suggestions?


Well,here are a few benchmarks....

*1. Unigine Heaven 2.1*

*img38.imageshack.us/img38/1465/uniginev.jpg



*2. Crysis : Settings : High @1600*900 16xAF 4xAA*

*img43.imageshack.us/img43/6260/crysistt.jpg



*3. 3DMark 2006 @1600*900 16xAF 8xAA*

*img571.imageshack.us/img571/6603/56388833.jpg



*4. 3DMark Vantage : Entry preset (w/o feature tests as it wont run in my pc due to resolution constraints  )*

*img257.imageshack.us/img257/3382/3dve.jpg




*5. 3DMark Vantage : Perfomance present (theres no P score as it has been run at 1600*900,and P cant be given below 1280*1024  best I cud do)*


*img842.imageshack.us/img842/8849/vantageb.jpg

Comments please


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## mukherjee (Jul 24, 2010)

* Kombustor after 10mins run with temps *

*img812.imageshack.us/img812/6492/komz.jpg


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## coderunknown (Jul 24, 2010)

mukherjee said:


> Thanks buddy....Yes,support...thats more important to me than price...isnt it?



thats a very important factor. well one have to send the card for RMA if something goes wrong still a exchange can be made in case the bundle turns out bad or the card is defective.



mukherjee said:


> Yes,the vent's a bit of a problem...but worry not,my case ventilation is optimized,by 2 80mm fans and a CM 120mm fan  !!



than that shouldn't cause any problem. 1X120mm fan opposite PCIe slot & a 80mm fan under the PSU (if its top placed) will provide all the necessary ventilation.

BTW, i'll suggest change the PSU. GTX460 maybe cool running but is also a heavy on power card. invest in a Corsair VX450W. just a fraction of the price of the card to ensure its safety.


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## mukherjee (Jul 24, 2010)

Friends, I have tried my hand a bit on overclocking....
Upped 50Mhz each on the Core and Memory to get 750 Core 1500 Shaders 1850(3700) Memory

Results of temp:

*img843.imageshack.us/img843/8782/14514416.jpg

---------- Post added at 08:32 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:27 PM ----------




himadri_sm said:


> if there is any way to measure power consumption...can you tell me your idle & peak power usage?



Well, I used my UPS monitoring software to get a rough idea.
My UPS is 600VA rated...thats roughly 360 Watts AC(taking power factor as 0.6 worst case).

At idle,the load shows as 40%,thats a about 144 Watts.

At full throttle,the load comes up as 80%,thats about 288 Watts.

There,a rough idea of the power consumption.



Sam.Shab said:


> BTW, i'll suggest change the PSU. GTX460 maybe cool running but is also a heavy on power card. invest in a Corsair VX450W. just a fraction of the price of the card to ensure its safety.



*@ All, do I really need to change my PSU?*
What shud I go for? VX 450/VX 550/CM GX 550/Seasonic S12L 500 ????


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## asingh (Jul 24, 2010)

mukherjee said:


> Yes,u noted right...but how to measure the memory temps? Any idea?
> 
> Also,which is a better indicator of load temps..... Furmark or MSI Kombustor??



You should be able to see temperatures using GPU-Z, RivaTuner(singular or via the GPU Monitor Gadget which integrates to Riva Tune), or Everest Lavalys (via the Everest Gadget). Below is a screen shot.



himadri_sm said:


> if there is any way to measure power consumption...can you tell me your idle & peak power usage?



Not really. One can estimate using various online calculators, or install a device between the wall socket and PSU/UPS socket top. Something like a Kill-o-Watt easily available on eBay.

*img405.imageshack.us/img405/7708/monitoringgpumemtemp.png


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## topgear (Jul 26, 2010)

^^ GPU-Z don't show memory temps for nvidia cards. As far as I know their is no way to test memory temp of nvidia cards using some software - only some infrared temp sensor can be used to measure that temp on a open bench.

@ *mukherjee* - 1st of all hearty congrats for that nice purchase and thanks for the detailed pics and benchmarks :

I was a little bit surprised though pleased to see that this card is running on a CM extreme 500W - are you planing to buy a new PSU - if so a Corsair VX450W would be enough for your present rig.

From the pics you've posted it's seems like it has the same MOSFET/VRM heatsink missing issue .

This article can be found in here

Compare this pic with the pic no 6 your post ( they have removed the two pictures from that news article which reveals the compariosn )

your pic :

*img30.imageshack.us/img30/3485/dsc013091280.jpg

The review pic

*www.guru3d.com/imageview.php?image=24923

Look at the solid states capacitors at the left side and you will see some mosfet heatsink there.


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## asingh (Jul 26, 2010)

^^
Even Riva will not..? Think nTune can. I used to able to be on my 8500GT.


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## Piyush (Jul 26, 2010)

the card looks deadly
even the benchmark result is quite good
temp readings are fine too


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## topgear (Jul 27, 2010)

@ *asigh* - thanks for the info. I think ntune is a bulky piece of software though for OPs mobo and gfx card combo it may be suitable and Op should give ntune a try to see if it can display the mem temp of his GTx460.


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## Piyush (Jul 27, 2010)

this card looks a lil bit like ASUS ARES


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## rajan1311 (Jul 27, 2010)

asigh said:


> What are your memory temperatures. They seem passively cooled..?



most(if not all) of the GTX 460 cards dont have any Memory Heatsinks...but even the clocks are pretty low as compared to ATI cards...


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## mukherjee (Jul 27, 2010)

topgear said:


> ^^ GPU-Z don't show memory temps for nvidia cards. As far as I know their is no way to test memory temp of nvidia cards using some software - only some infrared temp sensor can be used to measure that temp on a open bench.
> 
> @ *mukherjee* - 1st of all hearty congrats for that nice purchase and thanks for the detailed pics and benchmarks :
> 
> ...



Well, u are talking about the Sonic Platinum Edition cards,mine is only Sonic edition.



piyush120290 said:


> the card looks deadly
> even the benchmark result is quite good
> temp readings are fine too



Thanks!



topgear said:


> @ *asigh* - thanks for the info. I think ntune is a bulky piece of software though for OPs mobo and gfx card combo it may be suitable and Op should give ntune a try to see if it can display the mem temp of his GTx460.



Here u go then...no option even for mem temps 

*img713.imageshack.us/img713/2764/ntune.jpg



piyush120290 said:


> this card looks a lil bit like ASUS ARES



Thats pushing things a bit too far I guess 



rajan1311 said:


> most(if not all) of the GTX 460 cards dont have any Memory Heatsinks...but even the clocks are pretty low as compared to ATI cards...



+1 on that


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## topgear (Jul 28, 2010)

^^ all palit GTX 460 cards looks almost exactly the same so they should have provided those mosfet coolers on all cards as well 

a strange thing is plait is not show interested in showing the clock speed differences on their website - there's no details about clock speeds in specs for any GTX460 in the website.

well I will look for programs which can show mem temps for nvidia gfx card and let you know.


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## mukherjee (Jul 29, 2010)

Friends, I hv decided to buy a new PSU at last.
Keeping an eye to the future,it will be 550W at least.

I have two options : Cooler Master GX550 @ 4.7k

or Corsair VX550W @ 5.1k.

Which one shud I choose?

Any naysayers, have a look at this
Updated Palit GTX 460 Sonic Platinum results


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## coderunknown (Jul 29, 2010)

^^ if you can afford Corsair VX550W, i see no reason think about Cooler Master.


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## Faun (Jul 29, 2010)

^^+1......................


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## mukherjee (Jul 29, 2010)

I just wanted to share.
After a 2hr session of Metro 2033 @1600*900 AAA 16xAF,the GPUZ temp showed a max of 67 degrees C!

Thats acceptable by any means and Kombustor or Furmark temps show only the worst case scenario....Isnt it?


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## topgear (Jul 30, 2010)

That's a acceptable temp but then again 1600*900 resolution is not that much taxing for the gfx card anyway - if you really want to stress test your gpu by running some game then try running those resource hungry games at 1920*1200

Do you have AC in your room or else in summer season the temp will really go high.

You are running your cpu at stock speed which is 2.13 Ghz but I think this speed is not enough to go with GTX 460 - have you noticed any bottleneck in performance of the gpu ??

Though I would prefer corsair but from the specs it looks like CM 550W is better in +12V rating 

Corsair Vx550W +12V*41A = 492W
CM GX 550W +12V*44A = 528


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## mukherjee (Jul 30, 2010)

topgear said:


> That's a acceptable temp but then again 1600*900 resolution is not that much taxing for the gfx card anyway - if you really want to stress test your gpu by running some game then try running those resource hungry games at 1920*1200
> 
> Do you have AC in your room or else in summer season the temp will really go high.
> 
> ...



Point noted.
But from what I've come across in the reviews,the CM series use Sus'con caps rated @ 85deg C,whereas the Corsair VX series uses Nippon Chemicon caps rated @ 105deg C.
Also,the ripple current on the 12V and 5V rails of the CM series are much higher than that of the Corsair series.
Thats why I m in favor of Corsair. Wat say?

N abt the gpu side,no i dont hv an AC,but neither did I hv any probs with d Radeon HD4850(it was a hot card too,remember??).
And,I dont think I'll be gaming @ 1920*1200 soon 

---------- Post added at 10:37 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:35 PM ----------

How do you find if the cpu is bottlenecking the gpu?
Isnt 2ghz enuf to feed the gpu?


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## coderunknown (Jul 30, 2010)

^^ your GPU too fast. your ram is kind of slower (& less). proccy is way too slow to utilize the GPU fully.


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## topgear (Jul 31, 2010)

@ *mukherjee* - I would also like corsair for better quality but I only pointed at the higher +12V rating of CM's GX 550W  - but I have not recommended it anyway.

Yep, I can remember the red hot HD4850 - the heating probs was more with the stock coolers but if I can remeber correctly your's palit HD4850 uses a custom cooler instead 

Get a good cpu cooler Like CM Hyper 212 and OC the cpu to at-least 3 Ghz and if possible beyond that


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## mukherjee (Aug 1, 2010)

Bought a Corsair VX550 for 5.1k from M.D. Computers,Kolkata.

How much will CM Hyper 212 set me back by?
Coz i've already empited my piggy bank  20k in 2wks time.. 

Also,shud i upgrade to 4gb ddr2 800? my system warranty is over btw,3yrs up! shud the system die,my ddr2 s will be useless...


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## topgear (Aug 2, 2010)

Congrats !

CM Hyper 212+ ( widely available ) will cost you ~1.8k - you may have to lap this to get the best performance though.

CM Hyper 212 will cost you ~2.4k or so - bought it last year at that price 

If you are planning to stick with your current rig - OC it and planning to use windows 7 x64 thgen get another stick of 2 GB DDr2 ram.

BTW, in a 32 bit consumer grade OS like windows xp, vista or win 7 you will not be able to use more than 2.75 GB of ram anyway for mobo limitation even if you have 4 GB ram installed but in 64 bit OS the whole 4 GB ram will be usable


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## mukherjee (Aug 2, 2010)

topgear said:


> Congrats !
> 
> CM Hyper 212+ ( widely available ) will cost you ~1.8k - you may have to lap this to get the best performance though.
> 
> ...



So,it remains 2GB then,no 64bit for me 

Wont the intel stock cooler hold till a 2.4Ghz OC?

Here is the 3dMark Vantage Performance numbers(my old 17" CRT somehow ran!!!  )

*img839.imageshack.us/img839/4685/3dvp.jpg


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## topgear (Aug 3, 2010)

^^ The test requires 1280*1024 resolution and a normal 17 inch monitor supports 1280*1024 resolution very well 

The stock cooler can reach upto 2.6 - 2.8 GHz - depends on the season ie summer winter etc. - I don't recommend anything above with a stock cooler.

BTW, if you are going to use the stock cooler then load test your OC speed and temps using orthos/Prime 95 along with Realtemp or coretemp. Another good app is OCCT.


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## mukherjee (Aug 3, 2010)

topgear said:


> ^^ The test requires 1280*1024 resolution and a normal 17 inch monitor supports 1280*1024 resolution very well
> 
> The stock cooler can reach upto 2.6 - 2.8 GHz - depends on the season ie summer winter etc. - I don't recommend anything above with a stock cooler.
> 
> BTW, if you are going to use the stock cooler then load test your OC speed and temps using orthos/Prime 95 along with Realtemp or coretemp. Another good app is OCCT.



Well. I unlinked the FSB & DRAM clocks,then upped the QDR FSB to 1200 Mhz to get 2.4Ghz clock(up from 2.13Ghz).
Heres a CPUZ link

Go

I used Prime95 alongwith both realtemp and coretemp.

Heres what I got after 30mins of testing:

*img580.imageshack.us/img580/4015/55344893.png


The temps however are depicted differently on Coretemp and realtemp. How to explain?

And taking into account the highest temps,is it okay?

---------- Post added at 06:36 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:08 PM ----------

Frnz, have a look here


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## mukherjee (Aug 3, 2010)

As requested, I ran OCCT Gpu tests.

Both OCCT and GPUZ screenies posted.

*1. At stock speed *
*img153.imageshack.us/img153/3223/2010080322h00gpu1.png

*img375.imageshack.us/img375/4658/see.gif


*2. Core@750 Mhz Shaders@1500Mhz Mem@3700Mhz*

*img199.imageshack.us/img199/5272/2010080322h37gpu1.png


*img717.imageshack.us/img717/8431/13457144.gif


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## tkin (Aug 3, 2010)

Nice temps, definitely looking forward to buying it.


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## topgear (Aug 4, 2010)

@ *mukherjee* - your CPU temps are really nice - push it to 2.6 GHz.

I've seen realtemp and coretemp showing different temps on a e2180 @ 2.6 GHz - so no big deal about it though I believe realtemp is showing the correct temp anyway.

The GPU temps are still on the higher side - it would be better if you manage to keep it under 80C.


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## tkin (Aug 4, 2010)

topgear said:


> @ *mukherjee* - your CPU temps are really nice - push it to 2.6 GHz.
> 
> I've seen realtemp and coretemp showing different temps on a e2180 @ 2.6 GHz - so no big deal about it though I believe realtemp is showing the correct temp anyway.
> 
> The GPU temps are still on the higher side - it would be better if you manage to keep it under 80C.


It's the cabby that's at fault, my 9800GTX+(factory oc) touches 82c with OCCT with fan speed auto reaching 100%, so the temps look normal, in a well ventilated cabby it should remain around 78c.

I'm also looking for the MSI GTX460 1GB Cyclone edition, has the best temps but the cooler is open type as you can see:
*images.tweaktown.com/content/3/4/3423_07.jpg

So I'm worried about internal temps, i.e how this will effect my HDDs and the CPU, I have one 120mm front fan blowing in the hdds, two 80mm side fans one blowing in the CPU and one in the GPU, one 120mm back fan exhaust, so can anyone shed some light on that?


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## topgear (Aug 5, 2010)

I know in a well ventilated cabby the temps will be lower but I'm a little bit worried about the hot summer season - that's all.

I know how many fans your cabby has as I'm using the same wit some little mods - removed all the expansion guaard plates and fitted there a 80mm fan and cut a hole on the top of the cabby and fitted a 120mm fan 

but if you don't want to mod you can always get a better cabby like CM Elite 430 - at 2.7k it's a steal IMO.


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## tkin (Aug 5, 2010)

topgear said:


> I know in a well ventilated cabby the temps will be lower but I'm a little bit worried about the hot summer season - that's all.
> 
> I know how many fans your cabby has as I'm using the same wit some little mods - removed all the expansion guaard plates and fitted there a 80mm fan and cut a hole on the top of the cabby and fitted a 120mm fan
> 
> but if you don't want to mod you can always get a better cabby like CM Elite 430 - at 2.7k it's a steal IMO.


I'm gonna mod mine too, since I've got 3 Optical drives front ventilation is limited, so gonna punch a hole on top(120mm fan), and gonna punch one hole at side beneath the last fan a bit in front(80mm fan) so it blows into the GPU heatsink directly, no intention of buying a new cabby, better to get a cheap cpu cooler for 3k.

---------- Post added at 08:51 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:12 PM ----------

Got the card, Palit GTX460 1GB Sonic @ 14,040/-(incl. tax).

Images here: *www.thinkdigit.com/forum/hardware-q/45694-post-your-latest-purchase-177.html#post1270277


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## topgear (Aug 6, 2010)

^^ congrats for your purchase 

BTW, is the palit gtx 460 768MB version available ??


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## tkin (Aug 6, 2010)

topgear said:


> ^^ congrats for your purchase
> 
> BTW, is the palit gtx 460 768MB version available ??


Don't know that, will ask today.


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## tkin (Aug 6, 2010)

Got rid off that blasted GTX460 Sonic, got a HD5850, no need for a nuclear oven in my cabby.


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## topgear (Aug 7, 2010)

^^ did you returned that card to the shop or sold it to someone ? what did you say to them anyway ?

So at the end of the day here's the summary : If you want a GTX 460 and don't want to gamble with you money stay away from Palit or Zotac and wait for some other manufacturer - if you want a good room heater in the upcoming winter season then you may try those cards anyway 

BTW, congrats again for the shiny new HD5850


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## DigitalDude (Aug 7, 2010)

^^^ there's nothing wrong with zotac bro... they even offer 5 yrs warranty (2 + 3 after registering on the web)


_


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## tkin (Aug 7, 2010)

topgear said:


> ^^ did you returned that card to the shop or sold it to someone ? what did you say to them anyway ?
> 
> So at the end of the day here's the summary : If you want a GTX 460 and don't want to gamble with you money stay away from Palit or Zotac and wait for some other manufacturer - if you want a good room heater in the upcoming winter season then you may try those cards anyway
> 
> BTW, congrats again for the shiny new HD5850


Thanks, just played metro 2033 maxed out and no noticeable lags, just awesome and temps stays around 80-83c and the fan goes to only 37%, super quiet.

Answered your question on the other thread(*www.thinkdigit.com/forum/hardware-q/82664-hardware-you-should-not-buy-21.html#post1270804), I returned it, next time I'm gonna get my GPUs imported from singapore(my cousin lives there), i really wanted the gigabyte twin fan GTX460 or the Asus DirectCu GTX460, both are good but not available here.

---------- Post added at 09:32 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:29 AM ----------




DigitalDude said:


> ^^^ there's nothing wrong with zotac bro... they even offer 5 yrs warranty (2 + 3 after registering on the web)
> 
> 
> _


I don't think you'll get full 5yrs here, my EVGA says 10yrs warranty but Tirupati(distro) said they will give 3yrs, same with XFX, they offer double lifetime warranty(10yrs) but here Rashi(distro) gives 3yrs, so make sure to check with the distro first.


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## DigitalDude (Aug 7, 2010)

^^^ the country manager of zotac India himself clarified on this 5yr warranty in techenclave forums, so we can be sure about that.


_


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## coderunknown (Aug 7, 2010)

^^ Rashi or Tirupati or whoever is the distributor won't give a damn to their words. so if something goes wrong, you may need to take it to the manager himself.


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## DigitalDude (Aug 7, 2010)

^^^ distributor is aditya infotech and they are much much better than rashi or tirupati.

that guy said after the first 2yr standard warranty, we have to book the rma request online and they will direct the distri (aditya infotech) in the rma process.


_


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## topgear (Aug 8, 2010)

^^ that guy is absolutely wrong.

Zotac offers 2 years standard and 3 years extended total 5 years warranty but to avail the extended warranty you have to register the card on Zotac's website within 14 days of the purchase.

---------- Post added at 05:16 AM ---------- Previous post was at 05:10 AM ----------




Sam.Shab said:


> ^^ Rashi or Tirupati or whoever is the distributor won't give a damn to their words. so if something goes wrong, you may need to take it to the manager himself.



But it won't be a simple task I'm sure.



tkin said:


> Thanks, just played metro 2033 maxed out and no noticeable lags, just awesome and temps stays around 80-83c and the fan goes to only 37%, super quiet.
> 
> Answered your question on the other thread(*www.thinkdigit.com/forum/hardware-q/82664-hardware-you-should-not-buy-21.html#post1270804), I returned it, next time I'm gonna get my GPUs imported from singapore(my cousin lives there), i really wanted the gigabyte twin fan GTX460 or the Asus DirectCu GTX460, both are good but not available here.
> 
> ...



thanks for posting and I've read that.

So for us local warranty plays a major role other than those big warranty claims.

BTW, do we have to register our purchased products on the manufacturer site to get the 3 years warranty that those distributors are providing.


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## DigitalDude (Aug 8, 2010)

topgear said:


> ^^ that guy is absolutely wrong.
> 
> Zotac offers 2 years standard and 3 years extended total 5 years warranty but to avail the extended warranty you have to register the card on Zotac's website within 14 days of the purchase.



yes you have to register the card within 15 days of purchase to avail extra 3 years warranty, but to claim warranty after two years you don't go directly to the distri instead you go through the online route and then to the distri. that was what I was telling. 


_


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## tkin (Aug 8, 2010)

topgear said:


> ^^ that guy is absolutely wrong.
> 
> Zotac offers 2 years standard and 3 years extended total 5 years warranty but to avail the extended warranty you have to register the card on Zotac's website within 14 days of the purchase.
> 
> ...


No need to register, but better if you will, that leaves any holes closed that the distros may exploit.

---------- Post added at 11:05 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:03 AM ----------




DigitalDude said:


> yes you have to register the card within 15 days of purchase to avail extra 3 years warranty, but to claim warranty after two years you don't go directly to the distri instead you go through the online route and then to the distri. that was what I was telling.
> 
> 
> _


That can a be a bit painful because for warranties the local distro has the final say here, you may have to mail the card to delhi at your own expense and pay for return shipping.


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## mukherjee (Aug 8, 2010)

My new fans helped lower the load temp by 2  degrees C.

*img96.imageshack.us/img96/889/newug.jpg

Seems like I gotta go for a CM Elite 430 soon...


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## DigitalDude (Aug 8, 2010)

tkin said:


> That can a be a bit painful because for warranties the local distro has the final say here, you may have to mail the card to delhi at your own expense and pay for return shipping.



you are assuming many things, anyway it is not your fault but the pathetic attitude of many indian distributors 

read these two posts: 

[GO] Zotac GTX 460 1GB - Rs 14490/- | Get Prince of Persia The Forgotten Sands+ Rs 500 off

[GO] Zotac GTX 460 1GB - Rs 14490/- | Get Prince of Persia The Forgotten Sands+ Rs 500 off


_


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## tkin (Aug 8, 2010)

*Hey, mukherjee, what is happening with your msi Kombustor(or your GPU)?*, I ran mine(the version that ships with MSI afterburner 1.61) and I'm getting average 789FPS, with minimum 722, you are getting minimum 1FPS and average 37???????

See:
*img194.imageshack.us/img194/1727/20100808204055.jpg

Am I missing something?

PS: Theres is nothing to configure the Kombustor right? also Kombustor is just furmark, i remember getting high FPS with my 9800GTX+ AA off, what's the issue? Is your GPU throttling?


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## funkysourav (Aug 8, 2010)

mukherjee said:


> My new fans helped lower the load temp by 2  degrees C.
> Seems like I gotta go for a CM Elite 430 soon...



which cabby are you using?
what is your fan configuration?


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## mukherjee (Aug 8, 2010)

tkin said:


> *Hey, mukherjee, what is happening with your msi Kombustor(or your GPU)?*, I ran mine(the version that ships with MSI afterburner 1.61) and I'm getting average 789FPS, with minimum 722, you are getting minimum 1FPS and average 37???????
> 
> Am I missing something?
> 
> PS: Theres is nothing to configure the Kombustor right? also Kombustor is just furmark, i remember getting high FPS with my 9800GTX+ AA off, what's the issue? Is your GPU throttling?



I use 1440*900 res with post processing on and unlock power draw on.
Please use these settings to find out.

I use Kombustor v1.1.2 installed separately.


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## topgear (Aug 9, 2010)

DigitalDude said:


> yes you have to register the card within 15 days of purchase to avail extra 3 years warranty, but to claim warranty after two years you don't go directly to the distri instead you go through the online route and then to the distri. that was what I was telling.
> _



got it but as tkin has said the honesty of local distributor or even the company plays a major role in warranty.

Check out my siggy and you will come to know what I'm trying to say.



tkin said:


> No need to register, but better if you will, that leaves any holes closed that the distros may exploit.




yep, I also think that.



funkysourav said:


> which cabby are you using?
> what is your fan configuration?



He has Zebroinics Antibiotic cabby if I'm not wrong and it can hold one front , top, side and back 80mm fan.

@ *mukherjee* - where you will place that 120mm fan you've just bought - are you planning to mod your cabinet or buying a new one ?


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## mukherjee (Aug 9, 2010)

topgear said:


> He has Zebroinics Antibiotic cabby if I'm not wrong and it can hold one front , top, side and back 80mm fan.
> 
> @ *mukherjee* - where you will place that 120mm fan you've just bought - are you planning to mod your cabinet or buying a new one ?



Yes u got that right.

Well, i've placed the new 120mm at front as "in",i have a 120mm at the back as exhaust,and i've replaced the side 80mm fan in exhaust config.

also,a top 80mm is there. Still,temps are high.

IMo,i shud get a new cabby... What say?


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## topgear (Aug 10, 2010)

Front and back fan placement is correct.

Place the side fan as intake mode and the top fan as exhaust.

See if you can get any improvements in temps.


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## Faun (Aug 10, 2010)

Just WOW !!!
GTX 460 SLI vs. HD 5850 CrossFireX - GeForce GTX 460 1GB SLI vs. Radeon HD 5850 CFX | [H]ard|OCP
GTX 460 1GB SLI vs. HD 5870 CFX - GeForce GTX 460 1GB SLI vs. Radeon HD 5870 CFX | [H]ard|OCP

GTX 460 SLI rocks


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## asingh (Aug 10, 2010)

^^
Yes it is really good when running 2x Cards. How much is a GTX460 OC'ed these days...? I guess the tessellation in Dx11 is killing the red cards. nVidia tessellators are better for sure.


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## topgear (Aug 11, 2010)

So this is one more reason why we should  go with SLi.

it's really awesome to see a approximately 30k gpu setup can beat up a 48k gpu setup


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## Piyush (Aug 11, 2010)

what wil be the power requirtements for the sli setup of gtx 460 and Xfire setup of 5850?


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## rajan1311 (Aug 11, 2010)

a decent 650W PSU should handle it..


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## funkysourav (Aug 11, 2010)

@mukherjee
what idle and load(while gaming)temps are you getting on the card?


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## asingh (Aug 11, 2010)

piyush120290 said:


> what wil be the power requirtements for the sli setup of gtx 460 and Xfire setup of 5850?



Any >=650W well branded PSU which has four PEG connectors...!


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## mukherjee (Aug 11, 2010)

funkysourav said:


> @mukherjee
> what idle and load(while gaming)temps are you getting on the card?



idle,as i said before,hovers around the 38-39degrees.

In game,the max i noted after 1hr of Metro 2033 was 67 degrees.

Is that ok?


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## tkin (Aug 11, 2010)

mukherjee said:


> idle,as i said before,hovers around the 38-39degrees.
> 
> In game,the max i noted after 1hr of Metro 2033 was 67 degrees.
> 
> Is that ok?


Its ok but try running warhead maxed out and report load temps, load a map and play for an hour, report temps, that's the max temps you'll get on your gpu(apart from furmark or such but try to stay away from those, members in guru3d just said to me that with such high ambient here I should not run power viruses specially kombustor with unlock power draw on, it can kill your card)
.


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## funkysourav (Aug 11, 2010)

just offtopic and curious,
can the GTX460 play metro 2033 in high settings at 1600x900 and physx medium?
does the physx churn too much out of the card?

---------- Post added at 10:40 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:37 PM ----------

does physx add some serious eyecandy to the gameplay?


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## tkin (Aug 11, 2010)

funkysourav said:


> just offtopic and curious,
> can the GTX460 play metro 2033 in high settings at 1600x900 and physx medium?
> does the physx churn too much out of the card?


Theres no physx low-medium-high, its either on or off and turning it on kills the GTX460, it can play high but physx off, actually you can play it on very high but physx off, otherwise your framerate will take a bad hit(<30).

Not much eye candy, a few spider webs and flags in a specific level swings in air.


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## funkysourav (Aug 11, 2010)

hmm
physx is a badass resource sucker you say?
metro must be a terribly coded game!!
what about physx in games like mass effect2?

p.s.
we are royally screwed if crytek decides to go physx in crysis 2!!


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## tkin (Aug 11, 2010)

funkysourav said:


> hmm
> physx is a badass resource sucker you say?
> metro must be a terribly coded game!!
> what about physx in games like mass effect2?
> ...


Mass Effect 2 does not use physx and yes metro is very unoptimized, most used physics engine is now havoc and it runs on cpu only and its owned by intel, so it comes down to the processor.


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## asingh (Aug 11, 2010)

Metro is also a killer since it has tessellation. Both nVidia and ATI cards have weak tessellator integration on the die. Since it is first release for them. I am able to run Metro just fine, get around 55+ fps, but of course tessellation is not there.


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## tkin (Aug 11, 2010)

asigh said:


> Metro is also a killer since it has tessellation. Both nVidia and ATI cards have weak tessellator integration on the die. Since it is first release for them. I am able to run Metro just fine, get around 55+ fps, but of course tessellation is not there.


Actually enabling DX11(tessallation) butchers midrange cards like HD5850/GTX460 etc.


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## funkysourav (Aug 12, 2010)

Tkin said:
			
		

> Mass Effect 2 does not use physx


no, mass effect 2 does use physx
check it on the net! (wikipedia)



			
				Tkin said:
			
		

> most used physics engine is now havoc and it runs on cpu only and its owned by intel


does havok run on AMD processors,
 or is it bound with Intel processors only, like the case of PHYSX?



			
				Asigh said:
			
		

> Both nVidia and ATI cards have weak tessellator integration on the die. Since it is first release for them.


i heard that GTX 460 has better tessellation capability than HD5850!!
isn't the tesselator in GTX460 strong enough to run metro?


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## rajan1311 (Aug 12, 2010)

^Its 30fps at very high, DX11 at 1280x1024. Thats good enough, but only for people like me with a 19" screen 

But the bright side is, its better than a 5850 when tessellation is used.


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## asingh (Aug 12, 2010)

funkysourav said:


> no, mass effect 2 does use physx
> check it on the net! (wikipedia)


Correct, yes it uses nVidia PhysX proprietary. The pack would need to be installed, else the game will not launch.



funkysourav said:


> does havok run on AMD processors,
> or is it bound with Intel processors only, like the case of PHYSX?


Havok can run on any CPU. Red Falcon Guerilla and TimeShift used it beautifully.



funkysourav said:


> i heard that GTX 460 has better tessellation capability than HD5850!!
> isn't the tesselator in GTX460 strong enough to run metro?


[/QUOTE]
Not sure which has the better tessellators, but the HD5850 and HD5870 were beaten by the tessellation of GTX470 and GTX480 respectively. As of now, no GPU is really doing a good job. The polygons get broken down far too much.


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## funkysourav (Aug 12, 2010)

Asigh said:
			
		

> Correct, yes it uses nVidia PhysX proprietary. The pack would need to be installed, else the game will not launch.


does that mean it wont run without physx??
if it runs on ati 5xxx cards,
what's the damage in terms of eyecandy?
i.e if physx can be disabled


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## Piyush (Aug 12, 2010)

funkysourav said:


> does that mean it wont run without physx??
> if it runs on ati 5xxx cards,
> what's the damage in terms of eyecandy?
> i.e if physx can be disabled



some games setups comes with the physx drivers along with them like borderlands and singularity

it doesnt matter which card u have
u must have those drivers installed on ur system

i tried it once
i uninstalled those drivers and then tried to ru that games
both showed same error(i dont remember the exact words)


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## asingh (Aug 12, 2010)

funkysourav said:


> does that mean it wont run without physx??
> if it runs on ati 5xxx cards,
> what's the damage in terms of eyecandy?
> i.e if physx can be disabled



See, basically PhysX (nVidia) is NOT a driver. It is a middle ware engine + SDK which can be used to accelerate on the GPU. Now since these API calls are embedded within the game code (much easier then writing own code to handle Physics) the came "checks" for the necessary engine components (software) before launching, be it ATI GPU or nVidia GPU. Now if there is an nVidia card installed PhysX will render, else it does not. Without PhysX, many say it is fine, others say it is cr$$. Totally depends on personal point-of-view.

What Piyush, said makes total sense. If the pack is not installed game will not launch. I remember trying to play Scorpion Disfigured without the PhysX pack, it never launched. Most games which are nVidia PhysX compatible install the pack as part of the standard installer.


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## funkysourav (Aug 12, 2010)

no what i mean to say is that
games whichhave Physx middleware in them,
can they run in Ati cards with Physx turned off?
i heard that BATMAN AA severely cripples Ati HD5770 cards in physx and non physx both!!


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## asingh (Aug 12, 2010)

^^
If ATI GPU, PhysX will not render. The game (which ever) is getting crippled due to some other reason.


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## tkin (Aug 12, 2010)

funkysourav said:


> no, mass effect 2 does use physx
> check it on the net! (wikipedia)
> 
> 
> ...


Well, mass effect physx run on cpu not on gpu and hence does not limit ati users, also the game has limited physics, bfbc2 has some nice physics.

Havok run on all cpus but intel might have tried to optimize it more for intel cpus(look in the intel compiler bias fiasco a few months back).

GTX460 like all other fermis lack a fixed tessallator in their card, they use the shaders to compute the tessallation data, whereas AMD has a fixed tessallator in their cards, so fermi does better because the shaders are more powerful than any tessallator chip can ever be, its a very good innovation on nVidias part but also note that turning on tessallation affects the fermi framerate more than HD5xxx series framerate as AMD has a dedicated tessallator. 

PS: Tessallation has yet to show any big improvements in games because most game engines like unreal engine do not use tessallation by default and hence it is added like a add-on in game and runs like crap, until the engine is build from ground up to use tessallation it won't happen, and that's not until the next consoles come out @ 2012 earliest.


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## asingh (Aug 12, 2010)

^^
Tessellation is not driven via an engine. It is part of the Dx11 API. Developers can make the API call in the game code, and it will get harnessed to the GPU hardware for processing and rendering.


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## Piyush (Aug 12, 2010)

@funkysaurav
u must be talkin about these results

*media.bestofmicro.com/3/D/226921/original/Batman PhysX Off.png

*media.bestofmicro.com/3/E/226922/original/Batman PhysX On.png


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## tkin (Aug 12, 2010)

asigh said:


> ^^
> Tessellation is not driven via an engine. It is part of the Dx11 API. Developers can make the API call in the game code, and it will get harnessed to the GPU hardware for processing and rendering.


But there's a built in tessellator for amd cards(had it since HD2900 series)

Wikipedia(R600, ie HD29xx):



> Hardware tessellation
> The GPU is equipped with an extra feature which is not part of the current DirectX 10.0 specification. It contains programmable tessellation units, similar to those within the Xenos GPU (codenamed C1) also developed by ATI. This unit allows a developer to take a simple polygon mesh and subdivide it based on a curved surface evaluation function, with different tessellation forms as Bézier surfaces with N-patches, B-splines and NURBS, and even some subdivision surface techniques, which usually comes with a displacement map texture.[4] Essentially, this allows a simple, low-polygon model to be increased dramatically in polygon density in real-time with minimized performance loss. Scott Wasson of Tech Report noted during an AMD demo of the technology that the resulting model was so dense with millions of polygons that it appeared to be solid.
> 
> This unit is reminiscent of ATI's earlier TruForm technology, used initially in the Radeon 8500, which performed a similar function in hardware. While this tessellation hardware is not part of the current OpenGL or Direct3D requirements, and competitors such as the GeForce 8 series lack similar hardware, Microsoft has included Tessellation as part of their D3D10.1 future plans.
> ...



The tessellator was modified and put in HD4xxx(useless) and HD5xxx(used) series, while nVidia uses their shaders to compute the polygons. Its basically same, think of is as AMD has a bunch of shaders separated in HD5xxx series to do tessellation while nVidia uses their CUDA cores(shaders in the GPU) dynamically to compute tessellation data, so while on a pure tessellation performance basis HD5870 is not any more faster than HD5450 as both have same tessellator in them(clock speeds may vary) but in nVidia's case GTX480 is significantly faster in tessellation than GTX460 due to the extra shaders present in it.

More jargon here: Nvidia's form of Tessellation compared to AMD/ATI's form of Tessellation


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## asingh (Aug 12, 2010)

^^
Yes, I know that *Tkin*. What I meant was that there is no such engine within the game which enables Tessellation. I was referring to the software part of the rendering mechanism. The hardware details you mentioned make sense, nice link by the way..!

By the way, bot of us have discussed this before. So for the group, I will posts the links. Both our posts are back to back. The team will enjoy reading them...! 

Tkin's writeup on Tessellation.
Asingh's writup on Tesselation. 

And the original thread page is here, if you want to see the context of the conversation.


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## mukherjee (Aug 19, 2010)

new gpuz v0.4.5 screenie

*gpuz.techpowerup.com/10/08/19/54g.png


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## mukherjee (Aug 20, 2010)

Here are the updated temps after I set up the new CM 430 cabby.

*1. Gpu after 15mins idling*

*img294.imageshack.us/img294/6342/newrest.gif



*2. After a run of Kombustor*

*img718.imageshack.us/img718/9168/newstrs.jpg


*3. Stressing the CPU*

*img508.imageshack.us/img508/7153/newcpu.png

Uploaded with ImageShack.us


Comments please


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## asingh (Aug 20, 2010)

^^
Its cooling well. Expect 10C less using games..!


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## funkysourav (Aug 20, 2010)

very cool temps!!
you have nothing to worry!
but i wouldn't stress test the card so often,
maybe once in 2 months or so,
at max


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## mukherjee (Aug 20, 2010)

asigh said:


> ^^
> Its cooling well. Expect 10C less using games..!



Thanks! Hmmm...that wud be good.



funkysourav said:


> very cool temps!!
> you have nothing to worry!
> but i wouldn't stress test the card so often,
> maybe once in 2 months or so,
> at max




U are absolutely right. i jus went thru a vrm article yesterdayhere

No further stress for me,neither my gpu!


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## mukherjee (Sep 2, 2010)

Msi GTX 460 1GB HAWX launched!

 Techpowerup 

 Guru3D


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## DigitalDude (Sep 3, 2010)

^^^^ read the reviews, not that convincing decision over the cyclone. and not that clear choice like MSI 5770 hawk.

I decided to purchase the cyclone.

tweaktown review is also very good.


p.s dude playing too much H.A.W.X eh?? 

_


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## mukherjee (Sep 3, 2010)

DigitalDude said:


> ^^^^ read the reviews, not that convincing decision over the cyclone. and not that clear choice like MSI 5770 hawk.
> 
> I decided to purchase the cyclone.
> 
> ...



HAWX....yess...like it verrry much!
Waiting eagerly for HAWX 2!!!!!


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## karthikunleashed (Mar 10, 2011)

can u guys pls say where to buy a gtx 460 in chennai... and if so pls mention the price 










thanks in advance


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