# buying advice for workstation/gaming laptop under inr 140K



## shubhamgarg55583 (Oct 4, 2014)

Hello guys,

I have been searching for a laptop for few weeks now and I am still confused as to where i should go.
I need a workstation cum gaming laptop.
I am a college student, studying physics so I'll be using mathematica, matlab, simulation and analysis and programming along with mild 3D modelling in solidworks. 
I also want the laptop to be a decent gaming rig.
I need it to last atleast 4-5 years...

1) What is your budget? (INR or USD)
INR 140K 

2) What size & weight consideration (if any) would you prefer?
Mainstream; 15" - 16" screen
Desktop Replacement; 17" screen

3) What are the primary tasks you will be performing with this notebook? 
Analysis, Simulation, programming, basic 3D modelling, basically for physics research and mild gaming(crysis, cod, nfs, etc)


5) Any typical configuration in your mind you're eying for ?
i7 4700MQ+, 16gb, 1tb hdd, 128 ssd 

4) Are there any brands that you prefer or any you really don't like?
a. Like: not really, anyone who can provide good build quality and reliability 
b. Dislike: apple


6) Anything else you would like to say?
should i import?! (warranty issues)
It should be portable..college student, I'll be carrying it alot...
good battery backup(above average or at least average)
Do i need a quadro card?


I am loking at MSI gs60 2pe ghost pro and dell m4800(i7 4800mq, 16gb ram, k1100M, 9cell battery, 1tb hdd(no ssd))

Msi is sleek and sexy with light and thin body, but i am doubtful that it'll last 4 years plus there are warranty issues in india. MSI also has heating issues.

Dell is bulky, heavy but is upgradable, after sales support is pretty good with 3yr warranty. it is robust and reliable which is a good thing considering i am a little clumsy fellow.   I'll not be able to game on this machine which is kinda sad as i am more of a introverted guy and spend my free time with light gaming(currently)...

Please, if you have any more suggestion kindle give that too.


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## SaiyanGoku (Oct 4, 2014)

If you are open to importing the laptop, xotic pc has configs that'll curb stomp any laptop in India at the same price. Warranty is dependant on the OEM of course.

Now people say i recommend XOTIC PC | Sager NP8268-S (Clevo P150SM-A) - 15.6" Gaming Notebook to everybody. but why shouldn't I? Clevo/Sager has better configs and will be a better VFM purchase. we always get overpriced electronics here anyways. 

the base config of this laptop should cost around 1 lakh including the shipping and customs.


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## seamon (Oct 4, 2014)

OK Let's clear a few things.
1)Yes you should import.
2)You should import this: XOTIC PC | Sager NP8268-S (Clevo P150SM-A) - 15.6" Gaming Notebook.
3)Do NOT. I repeat. DO NOT BUY NVIDIA GTX GPU FOR CAD/PROFESSIONAL WORK. Nvidia handicapped GTX GPUs(so zero compute power) since the Kepler series and the only thing these GPUs are good for is gaming. Always go for Nvdia Quadro.
4)Nvdia Quadro K1100M in Dell m4800 is very very very very very weak. You'll just waste money if you buy that laptop. At least a K3100M is recommended. You can configure the above laptop to contain Nvidia Quadro K1100M.
5)If you want MSI laptop then XOTIC PC | MSI GT60 2OKWS-278US - 15.6" Workstation Laptop is a MSI workstation.
6)Do not listen to other people who say Lenovo Y50 VFM(Very fine machine/Value for money).
7)Try to get a core i7 4910QM CPU in Clevo.
8)Clevo is user-upgradable. 
9)No, you won't get warranty.


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## shubhamgarg55583 (Oct 4, 2014)

[MENTION=145143]SaiyanGoku[/MENTION] [MENTION=248727]seamon[/MENTION] I came across this laptop while searching this forum. The base specifications include 8gb ram, 750gb hdd which does not include alot of things that i am getting in dell and I am worried about importing hassles, shipping and warranty issues.


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## shubhamgarg55583 (Oct 4, 2014)

seamon said:


> OK Let's clear a few things.
> 1)Yes you should import.
> 2)You should import this: XOTIC PC | Sager NP8268-S (Clevo P150SM-A) - 15.6" Gaming Notebook.
> 3)Do NOT. I repeat. DO NOT BUY NVIDIA GTX GPU FOR CAD/PROFESSIONAL WORK. Nvidia handicapped GTX GPUs(so zero compute power) since the Kepler series and the only thing these GPUs are good for is gaming. Always go for Nvdia Quadro.
> ...


 [MENTION=248727]seamon[/MENTION]

3) so one shouldn't consider gtx870 even for beginners? 
4)I know K1100 is a bad deal but under my budget, that is all I am getting. I was thinking that I'll upgrade it later in my college life because as of now, I am more of a beginner so i won't need much computing power. 
5)If I am importing, then assuming 30K for shipping & customs, my budget drops to inr110K(~1800$). This rules out msi gt60
6) I hear ya.
9) If warranty is not available, then who here would be able to fix the laptop if it presents with any problem? or will i be able to diagnose and fix it myself?


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## seamon (Oct 4, 2014)

shubhamgarg55583 said:


> [MENTION=248727]seamon[/MENTION]
> 
> 3) so one shouldn't consider gtx870 even for beginners?
> 4)I know K1100 is a bad deal but under my budget, that is all I am getting. I was thinking that I'll upgrade it later in my college life because as of now, I am more of a beginner so i won't need much computing power.
> ...



3)For gaming it is very good. If you doing only beginner level then I think it should suffice.
4)K1100M gives the performance equivalent of a 45k laptop.
5)Clevo fits in I think.
6)K.
9)Yes. They are hell easy to diagnose and repair. You just have to use a screwdriver. They are designed for easy user maintenance.


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## SaiyanGoku (Oct 4, 2014)

shubhamgarg55583 said:


> [MENTION=145143]SaiyanGoku[/MENTION] [MENTION=248727]seamon[/MENTION] I came across this laptop while searching this forum. The base specifications include 8gb ram, 750gb hdd which does not include alot of things that i am getting in dell and I am worried about importing hassles, shipping and warranty issues.



dell india offers underpowered hardware for the price. why do you think dell one has an edge over the clevo one?

also see initial suggestion
*www.digit.in/forum/laptops-netbook...p-under-inr-140k-post2164969.html#post2164969



> *the base config of this laptop should cost around 1 lakh including the shipping and customs.*



add a 256 Gb msata SSD and another 8 GB ram stick when you get the laptop. the 750 GB hdd can be upgraded to 1tb free of cost on the customisation page itself and the list of upgrades doesn't ends there.


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## shubhamgarg55583 (Oct 4, 2014)

ok, so i thought about importing and assuming i find some way to avoid the customs...

Only the differences between the two configurations are mentioned below
Processor in both of 'em is i7-4910MQ

I have two broad choices

1. Sager NP8268-S (Clevo P150SM-A)

- NVIDIA® Quadro™ K1100M (2.0GB) GDDR5 PCI-Express DX11 [User Upgradeable] (SKU – GPU002) - [ETA: Oct.15]
- *24GB DDR3* 1600MHz [3x8GB] *Kingston HYPER X* (CL9) Dual Channel Memory (Windows 7 Home Premium not supported) (SKU - RAMX98)
- 1TB 5400RPM (w/ 8GB SSD Memory) Seagate *Hybrid* 64MB Cache [SATA III - 6GB/s] (SKU - HDD092)
- 6X Blu-Ray* Burner* + 8X DVDRW/CDRW Super Multi Combo Drive (Sager) (SKU - ODD083)
)

+ 2x120GB samsung evo ssd(apparently they are cheaper here) 

Cost: 128906.64($2094)+9898=Rs.138804.64


2. Sager NP8268-S (Clevo P150SM-A)

- NVIDIA® Quadro™* K3100M* (4.0GB) GDDR5 PCI-Express DX11 [User Upgradeable] (SKU – GPU021) - [ETA: Oct.15]
- 16GB DDR3 1600MHz [2x8GB] Dual Channel Memory (SKU - RAM04S)
- 1TB *7200RPM* [SATA II - 3GB/s] (SKU - HDD097) [No SSDs]
- 6X Blu-Ray Reader + 8X DVDRW/CDRW Super Multi Combo Drive (Sager) (SKU - ODD084)

Cost:Rs.140295.24($2279)

is it advisable it to sacrifice RAM, Optical Drive, HDD for a K3100 gpu for a beginner?
I am a beginner but I am learning, the only think stopping me right now is the hardware of my 5 year old machine. This laptop will be my lifeline in future so i hope that i dont have to buy an expensive GPU after atleast 2-2.5 years if i go with K1100M.


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## seamon (Oct 4, 2014)

shubhamgarg55583 said:


> ok, so i thought about importing and assuming i find some way to avoid the customs...
> 
> Only the differences between the two configurations are mentioned below
> Processor in both of 'em is i7-4910MQ
> ...



I am assuming that you'll need the laptop  to pursue professional work after your college.
1)Stick with K3100M. K1100M is very weak. You'll have to replace the GPU within a year if you go with K1100M.
2)Keep RAM to a min. Higher RAM will only add to customs. Ram is cheaper here.
3)A simple DVD drive is cheaper than no drive. 
4)Also, core i7 4810QM will also suffice for your work. You can opt for it to avoid budget constraints.
5)No import duties if you can get someone to bring it for you.


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## abhigeek (Oct 4, 2014)

[MENTION=145143]SaiyanGoku[/MENTION] lol...
I know those people


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## Siddhartht (Oct 4, 2014)

Dell Precision M4800 is selling for 143K with Quadro K2100M+Fingerprint+Smartcard(contact+contactless)+500GB 7200RPM drive+Intel Wireless AC+Full HD IPS+3 Year next day business warranty with ADP (why I mentioned those security related stuff, because you can minus them and save quite a few buck if you like).

Quadro K2100M is a good card, well apt for light gaming and provides good performance for your simulation related work(only if nvidia didn't cap the memory bus to 128 bit...). HP is overpriced in India with their ZBook series(143K for K610M and a Dual core i7. Seriously ?)

Quadro K3100M, well you can get it with Dell Precision M6800, but then again it is against portability and budget requirements. And for the sake of workstation, you are buying it because you need warranty and support. Consumers buy this units for the added warranty benefits and support, not alone for specification and build. (Importing a Clevo unit might give you assurance for future upgrades, but getting parts for a laptop upgrade is not easy.)

The only thing I dislike about M4800 is it's touchpad...which is smaller than touchpads available on circa 2008 laptops.


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## shubhamgarg55583 (Oct 4, 2014)

[MENTION=145143]SaiyanGoku[/MENTION] I get your point, the only thing i am kinda worried about is warranty but still I am quite pleased with your suggestion.
    [MENTION=248727]seamon[/MENTION]
Yeah, I'll ask someone to bring it for me.
2)I checked(at flipkart), RAM was expensive here as compared to XoticPC
3) 
4) I'll be needing a powerful processor and fast ram for my research work so I don't want to compromise on them.

Could anyone please explain the difference between these two rams and why the second one is more expensive?

1.16GB DDR3 1600MHz [2x8GB] Dual Channel Memory   $90
&
2. 16GB DDR3 1600MHz [2x8GB] Kingston HYPER X (CL9) Dual Channel Memory (SKU - RAMX99)    $160

And which one is better among these two
1.	1TB 7200RPM [SATA II - 3GB/s]
&
2. 	1TB 5400RPM (w/ 8GB SSD Memory) Seagate Hybrid 64MB Cache [SATA III - 6GB/s] 

I am waiting for Xoticpc's reply about installing K2100M in Sager!

 [MENTION=146294]Siddhart[/MENTION] I dont need a fingerprint scanner+smartcard but 500gb hdd is pretty small for my use and yes, I do love warranty and support but I don't know whether I should choose lower specifications of dell for this.

I am getting the following specs in M4800 for 140K


> Smartcard Reader Base for HD/FHD Panel and Windows 8
> Intel Core i7-4700MQ Processor (Quad Core, 6M Cache, 2.4 GHz, w/HD Graphics 4600)
> 39.6cm (15.6") UltraSharp FHD(1920x1080) Wide View Anti-Glare LED-backlit Premium Panel
> Smart Card Reader (Contact Only, No Contactless Smart Card Reader) and No Fingerprint
> ...


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## SaiyanGoku (Oct 4, 2014)

They have mSATA ssd slots and i think you'll need to replace the optical drive if you want to add a normal SSD along with the HDD.


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## Siddhartht (Oct 4, 2014)

shubhamgarg55583 said:


> [MENTION=145143]SaiyanGoku[/MENTION] I get your point, the only thing i am kinda worried about is warranty but still I am quite pleased with your suggestion.
> [MENTION=248727]seamon[/MENTION]
> Yeah, I'll ask someone to bring it for me.
> 2)I checked(at flipkart), RAM was expensive here as compared to XoticPC
> ...




Hyper X has better timings and lower latency, and I don't know about the other 90$ RAM. Also 1TB 7200RPM RAM is a better bet instead of a slower cached HDD. About SSD, it's a 2.5 inch drive, which fit into normal 2.5" slots, not into msata/m2 slots.

I have been using Amber, and it is way more taxing than any of CAD programs people use, and RAM latency have hardly made any difference.


Update : I would recommend you to remove the SSD option and go with default 500GB/1TB option for start ,swap 16gb RAM for 4/8GB, and upgrade GPU to K2100M. You can always add SSD and RAM afterwards, at much lower rates than dell provide them(without voiding warranty).


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## shubhamgarg55583 (Oct 4, 2014)

So it turns out SSD's aren't cheap here! 
 [MENTION=284377]Siddhartht[/MENTION] I was thinking of removing the SSD and upgrading the processor to 4800MQ and yeah, I can go with 8gb RAM with K2100M graphics!
But If I am buying from Sager, then i shouldn't consider Hyper X ram, right?


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## seamon (Oct 4, 2014)

shubhamgarg55583 said:


> So it turns out SSD's aren't cheap here!
> [MENTION=284377]Siddhartht[/MENTION] I was thinking of removing the SSD and upgrading the processor to 4800MQ and yeah, I can go with 8gb RAM with K2100M graphics!
> But If I am buying from Sager, then i shouldn't consider Hyper X ram, right?



OK let's clear things again.
1)You are skimping on the GPU.  You should never skimp on the most essential part of the laptop. Stick to Quadro K3100M. Trust me, other things are expendables, GPU is not.
2)core i7 4810QM is more than enough. core i7 4810QM+K3100M is recommended.
3)Clevo has a fingerprint scanner.
4)You can end up on more duties on RAM if you order it with extra RAM. Kingston HyperX is known for low latency. Also you cannot pair normal RAM with HyperX RAM.
5)Clevo has 1 2.5" DRIVE and 2 mSATA SSD slots. Only buy SSDs from Buy SSD in India | Online Laptop SSD Drives | SSD Drive Price in India. Samsung EVO mSATA SSDs are recommended as add ons.
6)1 TB 7200RPM drive is better.

Also replacing things in Clevo laptops(including CPU) is real easy except the GPU which requires a BIOS flash.

M4800 is overpriced.
 [MENTION=284377]Siddhartht[/MENTION]
What happened to the mighty advocate of HP laptops?


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## $hadow (Oct 4, 2014)

seamon said:


> OK let's clear things again.
> 1)You are skimping on the GPU.  You should never skimp on the most essential part of the laptop. Stick to Quadro K3100M. Trust me, other things are expendables, GPU is not.
> 2)core i7 4810QM is more than enough. core i7 4810QM+K3100M is recommended.
> 3)Clevo has a fingerprint scanner.
> ...


 Well explained


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## Siddhartht (Oct 4, 2014)

seamon said:


> OK let's clear things again.
> 1)You are skimping on the GPU.  You should never skimp on the most essential part of the laptop. Stick to Quadro K3100M. Trust me, other things are expendables, GPU is not.
> 2)core i7 4810QM is more than enough. core i7 4810QM+K3100M is recommended.
> 3)Clevo has a fingerprint scanner.
> ...




I would have advocated for ZBook, if it was under his budget(and mine too xD), I have personally used that and it's the build is better than Precision(I am talking about ZBook 17). And in terms of upgradability, it is certainly on par with Clevo, with standard MXM slot complaint with any HP released wGPU WITHOUT Bios upgrade(HP charges a slight premium compared to other after market resellers, but hey, you get it in India and with a warranty).  


He needs a laptop for light gaming, K2100M is sufficient for that. Even i7 4700MQ is fine for CAD and Matlab/Mathematica. It all rounds up with the fact that who has experience with such software, and their views. My friends (I am a third year Informatics student) who are in EC and IT department recommend Quadro K1100M(just for applications which require CUDA acceleration). I personally recommend K2100M for future prospects. 
Physics related simulation is not an easy task, honestly you can't do it with even Quadro K5100M. Mobile GPUs are just not suitable for them. A typical protein folding batch runs for 4 to 8 hours(on a Tesla), and that evolves lots and lots of physics(from charges to geometry). While K3100M is a good gpu, it doesn't justify the increased price tag, since the benefit he will get on his targeted software is marginal.

If you really want a compromise between Gaming and work, I would recommend AMD firepro. They are good enough for gaming and work too, and don't share driver problems found in their Radeon counterpart.
Also, I don't think Clevo provides enough on software side. Precision and ZBooks have enterprise level security and management software pre installed, which you might find useful later in your studies. (I personally require a smartcard reader to sync some lab equipments and servers with my laptop, although that is a rare case where you handle equipments with price in millions) 

One should think out of box while buying such laptops. You are spending quite some large amount of money, whereby you cannot afford to go wrong. (I have never ever in my life seen a Clevo laptop being used as a workstation(here or outside))


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## seamon (Oct 4, 2014)

Siddhartht said:


> I would have advocated for ZBook, if it was under his budget(and mine too xD), I have personally used that and it's the build is better than Precision(I am talking about ZBook 17). And in terms of upgradability, it is certainly on par with Clevo, with standard MXM slot complaint with any HP released wGPU WITHOUT Bios upgrade(HP charges a slight premium compared to other after market resellers, but hey, you get it in India and with a warranty).
> 
> 
> He needs a laptop for light gaming, K2100M is sufficient for that. Even i7 4700MQ is fine for CAD and Matlab/Mathematica. It all rounds up with the fact that who has experience with such software, and their views. My friends (I am a third year Informatics student) who are in EC and IT department recommend Quadro K1100M(just for applications which require CUDA acceleration). I personally recommend K2100M for future prospects.
> ...



1)You have to flash the vBIOS of the GPU itself to make it compatible with the BIOS of the laptop(including HP).
2)Skimping on the GPU is the worst choice one can make when buying a laptop. It's not about being sufficient now, it's about being future proof. 
3)IDK about Firepro. Radeon driver problems are pretty bad. Better avoid AMD cards.
4)We are talking Xotic PC here. The world's best Clevo reseller. They are willing to track down your laptop globally for just 50$. Even if your laptop is stolen by some International Mastermind, Xotic will track it down for you.
5)Clevo laptops are the most powerful laptops in existence. P150SM is only an entry level laptop. The highest end supports a desktop CPU(think core i7 4770K) and 2 Nvidia Quadro K5100Ms in SLI( Think Nvidia Titan).


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## Siddhartht (Oct 5, 2014)

seamon said:


> 1)You have to flash the vBIOS of the GPU itself to make it compatible with the BIOS of the laptop(including HP).
> 2)Skimping on the GPU is the worst choice one can make when buying a laptop. It's not about being sufficient now, it's about being future proof.
> 3)IDK about Firepro. Radeon driver problems are pretty bad. Better avoid AMD cards.
> 4)We are talking Xotic PC here. The world's best Clevo reseller. They are willing to track down your laptop globally for just 50$. Even if your laptop is stolen by some International Mastermind, Xotic will track it down for you.
> 5)Clevo laptops are the most powerful laptops in existence. P150SM is only an entry level laptop. The highest end supports a desktop CPU(think core i7 4770K) and 2 Nvidia Quadro K5100Ms in SLI( Think Nvidia Titan).



1) Think Tesla, not Titan. And Mobile Quadro(s) are never sold in SLI configuration (if someone is selling them, then they are defeating the purpose of Quadro), and it is rare to find Quadro in SLI in desktop scenario(and SLI is not the proper term, Maximus is).

2) Tracking a laptop is not an easy task, and of what use is a laptop when the precious data is gone. (And when something is stolen, it is usually broken down before).

3) Entry level AMD Firepro W4170M beats Quadro 3100M in openGL benchmarks. The area where it counts. And it is good for light gaming too. (Keyword, entry level, M5100 is better which is entry level option for Precision M4800)

4) We are talking about India here, where warranty problems play havoc and lack of laptop can render a semester useless. 

5) The present Kepler series is by definition obsolete now. If he really want to use CUDA 5.0 or 6.5, he should wait for Maxwell. K3100M and K2100M are not that different in terms of raw performance(difference of 200 cores at low clock rates). 

6) Buying a card directly from HP/Dell would not need any flashing, since the card comes pre configured for system.


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## kunalgujarathi (Oct 5, 2014)

Siddhartht said:


> 1) Think Tesla, not Titan. And Mobile Quadro(s) are never sold in SLI configuration (if someone is selling them, then they are defeating the purpose of Quadro), and it is rare to find Quadro in SLI in desktop scenario(and SLI is not the proper term, Maximus is).
> 
> 2) Tracking a laptop is not an easy task, and of what use is a laptop when the precious data is gone. (And when something is stolen, it is usually broken down before).
> 
> ...



Simple words!
Guys wait for Maxwell and next Intel Roadmap lauch in couple of months!


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## seamon (Oct 5, 2014)

Siddhartht said:


> 1) Think Tesla, not Titan. And Mobile Quadro(s) are never sold in SLI configuration (if someone is selling them, then they are defeating the purpose of Quadro), and it is rare to find Quadro in SLI in desktop scenario(and SLI is not the proper term, Maximus is).
> 
> 2) Tracking a laptop is not an easy task, and of what use is a laptop when the precious data is gone. (And when something is stolen, it is usually broken down before).
> 
> ...



1. Eurocom and Sager sells Maximus.
2. Xotic PC Article & Info Section - NAVBAR_TITLE
3. Hope driver problems don't render the laptops useless.
4. You don't have to play cricket with your laptop.
5. 576 to 768 is a lot.
6. I don't think Dell/HP will even sell MXM cards. OEMs usually don't. One has to order from eBay.

- - - Updated - - -



kunalgujarathi said:


> Simple words!
> Guys wait for Maxwell and next Intel Roadmap lauch in couple of months!



That's the right thing to do. Maxwell Quadros are going to be awesome. But alas, one will have to wait nearly 4-5 months for them.


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## Siddhartht (Oct 5, 2014)

seamon said:


> 1. Eurocom and Sager sells Maximus.
> 2. Xotic PC Article & Info Section - NAVBAR_TITLE
> 3. Hope driver problems don't render the laptops useless.
> 4. You don't have to play cricket with your laptop.
> ...




1) A laptop has to survive daily travel and hostel life. I guess sometimes it might need to go through occasional torture by roommates or batch-mates (Mine had to survive a fall from top shelf, ADP was used next day, case had a major dent, screen had a grid of dead pixels around corner, but the laptop was working). 

2) OEMs allow after market upgrades/or in house upgrade.

3) Precision and ZBooks are ISV certified. Driver problems will not render the laptop useless....unlike Clevo, which is...Xotic PC/Eurocom certified ? (Can they give their ISV report ?)

4) 576 to 768 is not a lot. Clock speeds matter. Quadros run at lower clock speed for stable and sustained performance.

5) Checked, none of them sell Mobile Quadros in Maximus configuration.


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## seamon (Oct 5, 2014)

Siddhartht said:


> 1) A laptop has to survive daily travel and hostel life. I guess sometimes it might need to go through occasional torture by roommates or batch-mates (Mine had to survive a fall from top shelf, ADP was used next day, case had a major dent, screen had a grid of dead pixels around corner, but the laptop was working).
> 
> 2) OEMs allow after market upgrades/or in house upgrade.
> 
> ...



1)Your problem. Not everyone is as carefree.
2)Link?
3)Clevo boasts world's largest forum support as basically all custom laptops are Clevo based. What's ISV?
4)K3100M provides more cores running at a higher clock speed(than K2100M) with a wider bus width(256vs 128 in K2100).
5)Eurocom Configure Model Configure GPU as 2xK5100m.


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## Siddhartht (Oct 5, 2014)

seamon said:


> 1)Your problem. Not everyone is as carefree.
> 2)Link?
> 3)Clevo boasts world's largest forum support as basically all custom laptops are Clevo based. What's ISV?
> 4)K3100M provides more cores running at a higher clock speed(than K2100M) with a wider bus width(256vs 128 in K2100).
> 5)Eurocom Configure Model Configure GPU as 2xK5100m.




1) Let's wait for thread starter's view. 

2) From official communication with Dell Support agent(through University liaison).  

3) Independent Software Vendor certification(certification from a software vendor, for example Autodesk, Adobe etc which assures that their software has tested for trouble free operation on system), that is possibly one of the things which makes a workstation a workstation. 

4) Please see the benchmarks which reflects the use of thread starter to see if difference is high enough. He is not asking for a gaming system. Comparing professional GPUs is not same as comparing consumer grade cards. One has to see the software in question.

5) Is that a laptop(with err...17m of battery life) ? And nvidia doesn't list Eurocom as official Maximus distributor. 

I have owned a Sony Vaio Z series laptop, a Panasonic Toughbook ,a workstation, and a HP Pavilion. I know the difference between a laptop made for masses and a laptop which is made for a niche.


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## shubhamgarg55583 (Oct 5, 2014)

wow, A lot of great ideas here...

I'll ask someone to bring it for me, if I am not able to find anyone then I'll definitely go with dell, so there aren't any issues regarding duties in RAM and SSD's(Both are cheaper at XoticPC). 

1) I do need good build quality because I am not one of those people who treat the stuff with extreme caution. Laptop Should be able to handle wear and tear.   [MENTION=284377]Siddhartht[/MENTION] You said your laptop was damaged, If m4800 gets damaged the exact same way then will Dell replace the Screen and fix the Dent free of cost, under warranty ofcourse?

2) I don't know how much i'll be be upgrading the machine once i buy it.

3)ISV certificate, good point...I'll contact XoticPC helpline for this and ask.

4) I feel Quadro K2100M will be a good option(or even K1100M) cause they are cheap and will be suffice for now. If need be I'll upgrade it to the new Maxwell GPU's later on.  

5)Researching for Clevo's performance, support and certification. 

I don't want to go for AMD GPUs cause of all the driver issues that I have heard. I trust Nvidia in this. 

About Maxwell Gpus:I Can't wait for 6-7 months for the GPU.


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## seamon (Oct 5, 2014)

shubhamgarg55583 said:


> wow, A lot of great ideas here...
> 
> I'll ask someone to bring it for me, if I am not able to find anyone then I'll definitely go with dell, so there aren't any issues regarding duties in RAM and SSD's(Both are cheaper at XoticPC).
> 
> ...



1) Clevo laptops are pretty solid built.

2)Nice incentive.

3)Dude, Clevo laptops are guaranteed to work with all professional software.  ISV is more of a brand thing. (A software that has been designed for windows will run in windows, no exception to that). Besides,if Clevo laptops were not designed for professional use then they wouldn't have had the option of a Quadro card in the first place.

4)If you are planning to replace GPU then go for base config instead. Go for GTX 870M now. It has many more CUDA cores than K1100M(more than 3x cuda cores with driver support for CAD applications. It will be enough for entry level CAD work since you are just beginning(I guess?). K1100M is very weak. It's not worth it.

Save money now and go for something along the lines of best Maxwell Quadro card. Buy from upgrademonkey. They are the best in business. They currently have K5100M on sale which even Xotic PC doesn't offer and that too tried and tested for Clevo P150SM.

5)Always do your research.

- - - Updated - - -

GTX 870M trumps K1100M in open GL performance by nearly 100%. Techically it is more powerful than even K3100M but in practice you'll notice much greater performance gains in K3100M due to better driver support. K1100M? Not so much.


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## shubhamgarg55583 (Oct 5, 2014)

[MENTION=248727]seamon[/MENTION] Have you ever used a Clevo laptop? Can you comment on their build quality and sturdiness as compared to Dell m4800?! They are a little heavy than dell so I hope it's worth the extra weight!

Yes, I am a beginner so that's why I was pushing for a cheap and reliable solution right now and hoping to go big when I am capable of.

For the next 2-3 years, My work will be mostly involved around mathematica/matlab so I hope gtx870 is better than K1100M(&/or K2100M)?!

And is gtx780 better than gtx870(is it cheaper too)?


----------



## seamon (Oct 5, 2014)

shubhamgarg55583 said:


> [MENTION=248727]seamon[/MENTION] Have you ever used a Clevo laptop? Can you comment on their build quality and sturdiness?! They are a little heavy than dell so I hope it's worth the extra weight!
> 
> Yes, I am a beginner so that's why I was pushing for a cheap and reliable solution right now and hoping to go big when I am capable of.
> 
> ...



1) Nope not yet. I have heard great things about them. I'll probably buy one next year.

2)GTX 780m is significantly better than GTX 870m. It contains 4x the CUDA cores of K1100M. 


Dell M4800 is a good laptop but no point in buying one for 1L 40k when all you get is K1100M.


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## Siddhartht (Oct 5, 2014)

shubhamgarg55583 said:


> wow, A lot of great ideas here...
> 
> I'll ask someone to bring it for me, if I am not able to find anyone then I'll definitely go with dell, so there aren't any issues regarding duties in RAM and SSD's(Both are cheaper at XoticPC).
> 
> ...




Yes, Dell will fix anything which is broken(although they are reluctant to change the whole laptop, but yes, they will replace damaged parts). One extreme example I can give is of my friend's inspiron, whose speaker grill had a crack, and they replaced whole base of laptop to rectify it. (I tried to negotiate about replacing my laptop, but according to them, that is possible only when whole machine cease to work, like water spills etc. Also try to make it more "accident" like in your correspondence) One more thing that is good about their service is that the person will service the laptop in front of you at your hostel/home, so you can oversee if things are right or not. 


Clevo laptops are not meant for work, they are meant to game. Even in a German university(to be precise, a research institute), I saw people using Apple/HP, instead of Clevo(although I did notice XMG/Clevo once), strange since Germany is one of the prime importer of Clevo laptops. 

I will recommend you to swap SSDs for a K2100M in initial configuration , and install one in Easy eject drive bay when you really need it.


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## seamon (Oct 5, 2014)

[MENTION=150630]sam_738844[/MENTION] owns Clevo P151SM I think. Ask him about the quality of Clevo laptops.


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## Siddhartht (Oct 5, 2014)

One more thing I forgot to mention in my previous posts is the availability of expansion slots. While Both Clevo and Dell are on par in it, Dell has one peculiar slot, which in theory, can be used in future to get an external GPU up and running(if you are willing to invest in a $199 peripheral), i.e. Express Card slot. While it might not give that much of a bandwidth when compared to mxm(I guess they use 8x lane), but the performance boost can be phenomenal in some cases. Imagine using a desktop GTX 970 with your laptop. (Express Card roughly provides 1x@3.0/2.0 bandwidth, which might not sound much, but is enough for a sizable increase in performance).

Sadly Dell doesn't ship their laptop with Thunderbolt port like HP or Apple does, otherwise they provide bandwidth comparable to 4x lane(that is actually more than enough for sustained data IO between GPU and CPU)

You can get adapters from VillageTronic or Sonnet.


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## SaiyanGoku (Oct 5, 2014)

Siddhartht said:


> One more thing I forgot to mention in my previous posts is the availability of expansion slots. While Both Clevo and Dell are on par in it, Dell has one peculiar slot, which in theory, can be used in future to get an external GPU up and running(if you are willing to invest in a $199 peripheral), i.e. Express Card slot. While it might not give that much of a bandwidth when compared to mxm(I guess they use 8x lane), but the performance boost can be phenomenal in some cases. Imagine using a desktop GTX 970 with your laptop. (Express Card roughly provides 1x@3.0/2.0 bandwidth, which might not sound much, but is enough for a sizable increase in performance).
> 
> Sadly Dell doesn't ship their laptop with Thunderbolt port like HP or Apple does, otherwise they provide bandwidth comparable to 4x lane(that is actually more than enough for sustained data IO between GPU and CPU)
> 
> You can get adapters from VillageTronic or Sonnet.



Clevo one has a user replaceable GPU. -_-


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## seamon (Oct 5, 2014)

Siddhartht said:


> One more thing I forgot to mention in my previous posts is the availability of expansion slots. While Both Clevo and Dell are on par in it, Dell has one peculiar slot, which in theory, can be used in future to get an external GPU up and running(if you are willing to invest in a $199 peripheral), i.e. Express Card slot. While it might not give that much of a bandwidth when compared to mxm(I guess they use 8x lane), but the performance boost can be phenomenal in some cases. Imagine using a desktop GTX 970 with your laptop. (Express Card roughly provides 1x@3.0/2.0 bandwidth, which might not sound much, but is enough for a sizable increase in performance).
> 
> Sadly Dell doesn't ship their laptop with Thunderbolt port like HP or Apple does, otherwise they provide bandwidth comparable to 4x lane(that is actually more than enough for sustained data IO between GPU and CPU)
> 
> You can get adapters from VillageTronic or Sonnet.



Clevo has 3 slots for external GPUs. 1 eSATA(external) and 2 mSATA(internal) slots which can be used for connecting external GPUs. They all have bandwidths greater than Express card slot(which is 5 GBit/sec?)
I had posted a guide sometime back on how to connect an external GPU using mSATA.
The thing is, the ports will never be able to utilize the power of a GTX 970. They will barely be able to utilize the power of a GTX 660Ti. SLI is out of question because the chipset won't support it.
You have to disable Nvidia Optimus for the laptop to even recognize SLI. 
Also, in a laptop with GTX 780M, GTX 660Ti(so whole external GPU concept) is useless. However a weak laptop with K1100M will see substanial gains(almost 3-4x) in gaming.

- - - Updated - - -

Moreover, the external GPU device for eSATA and mSATA cost as low as 99$ each.


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## Siddhartht (Oct 5, 2014)

SaiyanGoku said:


> Clevo one has a user replaceable GPU. -_-



But the cost of a MXM card far exceeds that of a normal desktop grade card.

  [MENTION=248727]seamon[/MENTION], I agree with your point, but using an msata slot for GPU requires case modding to some extent, where is case of express card slot, it's just equivalent to inserting a flash drive into port and restarting the laptop. The concept from what I have seen is not completely useless, but is more or less convenient. Also an esata port cannot be used for same purpose because it's just simple sata bus. Whereas in msata, it's an controversial case, some slots work as mini pciex/msata combo with signal multiplexing/pin sharing, some other work in dedicated msata mode on physical mini pciex slot with disabled pins, so msata slot might not work as mini pciex slot, but vice versa is true.

Edit: also the bandwidth is same in both the cases, i.e. 1x if we consider the pci express lane.


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## shubhamgarg55583 (Oct 5, 2014)

I am creating a comparison between Sager and Dell and will reply with that soon. I'm also looking at the presence of SAGER Brand in India.

Meanwhile, Should I consider this laptop. It was just released around a month ago(I guess). It is based on the design of GS60 GhostPro but is made as a workstation rather than a gaming laptop.

Update:
I like it very much. It's sleek, light and beautiful, so i am also willing to settle on lower specs(Processor). The only thing I am concerned about is heating issues. I have heard that the heat produced in a laptop can actually melt the components inside. If that's the case then I'll be in trouble as I won't get service for this laptop in India though warranty is relatively great(1 year global and accidental damage)


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## seamon (Oct 5, 2014)

The point is external GPUs are pointless in Clevo because the internal GPU will itself out power the external GPU due to bandwidth limitations. A desktop Quadro is pointless as an external GPU because they are very costly and the money can be instead utilized to buy a Maxwell Mobile Quadro later.
You are already getting a GTX 870M in the base config in the Clevo which will by default out power any external GPU connected.
The only possible advantage of getting a external GPU is when you opt for a weak K1100M/K2100M which is not a very smart thing to do.

Also I stand corrected eSATA cannot be used for eGPU. However, mSATA has 6Gbit/sec bandwidth while Express card has only 5Gbit/sec(making the point of having an eGPU even more pointless). mSATA with disabled pins are the ones used to connect the wifi card.


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## sam_738844 (Oct 5, 2014)

@op, when you buy a horse you dont put a saddle on it which might make it faster but only when it kills him.

You are going to buy a laptop, with* one hundred and forty thousand rupee*s and you are thinking of nailing it down with external GPU ?  Yes i own a Clevo laptop and i can play games at the airport in Singapore on a lounge chair with it on my lap. That's mobility and ís what i bought it for. If you know what i mean already, wait for Maxwell mobility series to kick in and buy a gaming notebook later, there is a lot to come in, and hopefully, no... *definitely* something to regret your decision about, or might as well the way you think about gaming laptop now. 140K on a gaming laptop must not be seen with anything outside the laptop.


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## seamon (Oct 5, 2014)

shubhamgarg55583 said:


> I am creating a comparison between Sager and Dell and will reply with that soon. I'm also looking at the presence of SAGER Brand in India.
> 
> Meanwhile, Should I consider this laptop. It was just released around a month ago(I guess). It is based on the design of GS60 GhostPro but is made as a workstation rather than a gaming laptop.



Its K2100M makes it less desirable. It is also not very customizable.
1)No MXM, so you can't replace GPU.
2)You'll void the warranty if you open the laptop.

- - - Updated - - -

Just on a side note, I advocate against installing a eGPU too btw.


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## shubhamgarg55583 (Oct 5, 2014)

seamon said:


> Its K2100M makes it less desirable. It is also not very customizable.
> 1)No MXM, so you can't replace GPU.
> 2)You'll void the warranty if you open the laptop.
> 
> ...



I know I can't upgrade/customize this laptop but at 0.85" and 1.9 kg, I am willing to close the deal right now for the next 4+ years. Is this advisable? 

I'll not be using eGPU

- - - Updated - - -



sam_738844 said:


> @op, when you buy a horse you dont put a saddle on it which might make it faster but only when it kills him.
> 
> You are going to buy a laptop, with* one hundred and forty thousand rupee*s and you are thinking of nailing it down with external GPU ?  Yes i own a Clevo laptop and i can play games at the airport in Singapore on a lounge chair with it on my lap. That's mobility and ís what i bought it for. If you know what i mean already, wait for Maxwell mobility series to kick in and buy a gaming notebook later, there is a lot to come in, and hopefully, no... *definitely* something to regret your decision about, or might as well the way you think about gaming laptop now. 140K on a gaming laptop must not be seen with anything outside the laptop.


  [MENTION=150630]sam_738844[/MENTION] No, I never talked about eGPU, it was just a feature pointed out by Siddhartht.

I am more interested in a Workstation rather than a gaming laptop. 
since I am a beginner, I am thinking of going with a cheaper card right now and upgrading it to a professional GPU after 1-2 years as need be.

Frankly speaking, I don't know much about those Nvidia maxwell cards people are talking about, are they the just released gtx970/gtx980 gpus?


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## seamon (Oct 5, 2014)

shubhamgarg55583 said:


> I know I can't upgrade/customize this laptop but at 0.85" and 1.9 kg, I am willing to close the deal right now for the next 4+ years.
> 
> I'll not be using eGPU



That'll be a very bad decision. This is because Maxwell is coming soon.
This. is still a better option. It is only 10k above your budget.
I don't think K2100M will be sufficient for next 2+ years(let alone 4+ years).

- - - Updated - - -

Maxwell GPUs=mobile version of the newly released GTX 980 and GTX 970.


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## shubhamgarg55583 (Oct 5, 2014)

seamon said:


> That'll be a very bad decision. This is because Maxwell is coming soon.
> This. is still a better option. It is only 10k above your budget.
> I don't think K2100M will be sufficient for next 2+ years(let alone 4+ years).
> 
> ...



Thank you for the explanation , i think the link is dead, could you please look into it?

and my budget initially was 125K, I am throwing 5K of my own and 10K borrowed from my sister, I don't think I can go any higher


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## seamon (Oct 5, 2014)

shubhamgarg55583 said:


> Thank you for the explanation , i think the link is dead, could you please look into it?
> 
> and my budget initially was 125K, I am throwing 5K of my own and 10K borrowed from my sister, I don't think I can go any higher



I strongly advise you to wait for Nvidia to release Quadro Maxwell mobile GPUs. Don't buy a laptop worth 1L+ with a weak GPU.


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## shubhamgarg55583 (Oct 5, 2014)

[MENTION=248727]seamon[/MENTION] How long would I have to wait, assuming that after their release, it'll take some time(3-4 months) for their price to come down and 1-1.5 month for the order to arrive?


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## seamon (Oct 5, 2014)

shubhamgarg55583 said:


> [MENTION=248727]seamon[/MENTION] How long would I have to wait, assuming that after their release, it'll take some time(3-4 months) for their price to come down and 1-1.5 month for the order to arrive?



Forget it, price won't come down. You'll get the same price at launch that you'll get after 3-4 months. Electronics in USA get replaced faster than prices can come down. The mobile segment is entirely different from desktop because you can buy old GPUs/CPUs in the case of desktops.

It'll definitely take some time but the wait will be worth it.


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## Siddhartht (Oct 5, 2014)

shubhamgarg55583 said:


> Thank you for the explanation , i think the link is dead, could you please look into it?
> 
> and my budget initially was 125K, I am throwing 5K of my own and 10K borrowed from my sister, I don't think I can go any higher



If you are ready to wait for something new, say Maxwell based Gpu, then you really don't need laptop now. I played the wait game.....and it lasted for a good 2 years. If you need something, just buy it. Considering electronics, kepler will be succeeded by maxwell in coming months, maxwell will again be succeeded by a refresh at the end of 2015 and a major refresh in 2016....so yeah, it's a perpetual thing. I got Vaio Z one and a half years ago, and it is close to being obsolete now?  But will I stop using it? No, I don't regret the decision, because it is one hell of a fine machine, which I use when on long trips. It does have that fancy external gpu/bluray dock which I find a gimmick mostly, but it is a subnotebook which has a quad core i7 which is still enough for most of the tasks I do. I have also used HP pavilion which was quickly outdated(second gen to third gen) but still I didn't regret buying it because it completed all the tasks which I required it to do, now it might have taken a minute or more than new cards in encoding, but that is fine by me. The end line is, go for the thing you like, and then just don't look back at things you left. If you want Sager or Dell, just see their present value, not future, because in future, things might be drastically different then they are now. The next generation of Intel processors might have graphics which might equivalent to mid range dgpus (see Iris pro 5200), but then again that is next generation, not present.

And just think about the money you are investing.


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## shubhamgarg55583 (Oct 5, 2014)

[MENTION=284377]Siddhartht[/MENTION] You're absolutely right, I need a laptop right now, so i won't be waiting for maxwell GPUs.....

MSI WS60 20J
Do I need to be worry about heating issues with this laptop? I know it has a weaker GPU(& not upgradable) but it has great mobility(& warranty) which I prefer more because I'll be moving alot.


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## seamon (Oct 6, 2014)

shubhamgarg55583 said:


> [MENTION=284377]Siddhartht[/MENTION] You're absolutely right, I need a laptop right now, so i won't be waiting for maxwell GPUs.....
> 
> MSI WS60 20J
> Do I need to be worry about heating issues with this laptop? I know it has a weaker GPU(& not upgradable) but it has great mobility(& warranty) which I prefer more because I'll be moving alot.



Go for it if you really want a laptop now. No heating issues or as such.
Also, the this laptop has a thunderbolt port. You can easily add a NVIDIA TESLA later with no bottleneck as Thunderbolt has 10GBit/sec bandwidth.


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## kunalgujarathi (Oct 6, 2014)

Guys uhh.....

A bit of offtopic but genuine suggestion!

You want laptop right?
Get this-
Runtime Error

Price in India- 1,49,000 FK

Price on Newegg- 71000 
Add Customs 15000
Its 86000/-

Rest of your saving deposit in Bank!
Make an F.D.(SBI or Cooperative Banks preferred! More Interest)

After 2 years upgrade-
Nice new gen CPU and A good Quadro!

This 870m will suffice easily uptill now!

Regards,
kunalgujarathi


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## kunalgujarathi (Oct 6, 2014)

kunalgujarathi said:


> Guys uhh.....
> 
> A bit of offtopic but genuine suggestion!
> 
> ...



I don't know why its showing runtime error-
Actual link-
Runtime Error
View attachment 14849


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## shubhamgarg55583 (Oct 6, 2014)

[MENTION=266361]kunalgujarathi[/MENTION] I've seen this laptop before, I loved it but I just can't come to terms with it's weight! 4.5Kg is alot to travel around.


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## Siddhartht (Oct 6, 2014)

seamon said:


> Go for it if you really want a laptop now. No heating issues or as such.
> Also, the this laptop has a thunderbolt port. You can easily add a NVIDIA TESLA later with no bottleneck as Thunderbolt has 10GBit/sec bandwidth.




Actually, I don't think anyone will buy Tesla for themselves(Unless they are totally into research and have a huge government grants). It took my University four months to decide if they want to buy Teslas or not.
In the end they did, and it was like 30L ? for 12 of them. 
Let me tell you the Typical scenario we follow with Tesla. I use a Windows tablet, upload the task remotely to a Tesla server, wait for a while and then view the result directly on my tablet. Efficient. Fast. Convenient. (Also, they now considering nvidia GRID servers).  

Second thing, Tesla will never work with Thunderbolt port, trust me, when you work with Tesla, you don't want any intermediate between CPU/Chipset/Bridge and GPU, their are driver issues, and simply, it has never been tried before I guess. 

Thunderbolt port has no utility unless you are willing to spend large amount of money on Thunderbolt/Intel certified peripherals , and even Displayport can daisy chain displays. Or unless you want to use custom cards from AVID and RED...(or an external gpu solution xD ).


Edit: To the thread starter, if you really want an upgradable system which is present in India, go for Alienware 17 base. 145K with 860M. Standard MXM slot with accidental damage protection and 1 year warranty.


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## shubhamgarg55583 (Oct 6, 2014)

Siddhartht said:


> Actually, I don't think anyone will buy Tesla for themselves(Unless they are totally into research and have a huge government grants). It took my University four months to decide if they want to buy Teslas or not.
> In the end they did, and it was like 30L ? for 12 of them.
> Let me tell you the Typical scenario we follow with Tesla. I use a Windows tablet, upload the task remotely to a Tesla server, wait for a while and then view the result directly on my tablet. Efficient. Fast. Convenient. (Also, they now considering nvidia GRID servers).
> 
> ...



A Big NO!  I don't need tesla, or thunderbolt(I know how expensive these devices are)!


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## SaiyanGoku (Oct 6, 2014)

shubhamgarg55583 said:


> I am creating a comparison between Sager and Dell and will reply with that soon. I'm also looking at the presence of SAGER Brand in India.
> 
> Meanwhile, Should I consider this laptop. It was just released around a month ago(I guess). It is based on the design of GS60 GhostPro but is made as a workstation rather than a gaming laptop.
> 
> ...



you can configure the clevo one to have better specs at the same price compared to this one.


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## shubhamgarg55583 (Oct 6, 2014)

ALienware is a no, again the weight issue...The laptop has to be less that 3Kg...I need it to be portable...The key reason I am eyeing MSI


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## kunalgujarathi (Oct 6, 2014)

shubhamgarg55583 said:


> ALienware is a no, again the weight issue...The laptop has to be less that 3Kg...I need it to be portable...The key reason I am eyeing MSI



If you want portability!
Then there are only two workstation class ultrabooks-
ZBook 13/15 And Dell Precision M3800!


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## shubhamgarg55583 (Oct 6, 2014)

I compiled a list and gave every config rankings accordingly, Please do tell me about any pointers/config I should add and/or change the rankings in the chart. 

 PFA




**Click PFA if attachment not working**

- - - Updated - - -



kunalgujarathi said:


> If you want portability!
> Then there are only two workstation class ultrabooks-
> ZBook 13/15 And Dell Precision M3800!


     [MENTION=266361]kunalgujarathi[/MENTION]  Zbook--too expensive, I am looking at dell 4800 instead of 3800.

- - - Updated - - -



SaiyanGoku said:


> you can configure the clevo one to have better specs at the same price compared to this one.



Yes, but MSI offers great portability, that's why I am considering MSI.


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## seamon (Oct 6, 2014)

shubhamgarg55583 said:


> I compiled a list and gave every config rankings accordingly, Please do tell me about any pointers/config I should add and/or change the rankings in the chart.
> 
> PFA
> 
> ...



Can't see attachment. Upload somewhere else.


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## shubhamgarg55583 (Oct 6, 2014)

Here, It's on google drive now.


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## SaiyanGoku (Oct 6, 2014)

Giving 5 more points just for around 1kg lesser weight? 

Carrying 3 kgs laptop in bag isn't a big deal.


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## shubhamgarg55583 (Oct 6, 2014)

SaiyanGoku said:


> Giving 5 more points just for around 1kg lesser weight?
> 
> Carrying 3 kgs laptop in bag isn't a big deal.



I gave it 5 points because of its selling point i.e. portability, similarly, dell has 5 points in warranty.

I just talked to a dell representative, I have to pay 5K extra for accidental damage warranty so the only thing i'll be getting covered is manufacturing faults.

- - - Updated - - -

I just talked to dell customer representative, the maximum capacity of dell m4800 is of K2100M so I can not change the GPU to K5100M or any other in the future.


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## seamon (Oct 6, 2014)

shubhamgarg55583 said:


> I gave it 5 points because of its selling point i.e. portability, similarly, dell has 5 points in warranty.
> 
> I just talked to a dell representative, I have to pay 5K extra for accidental damage warranty so the only thing i'll be getting covered is manufacturing faults.
> 
> ...



Guess that sucks hardcore.


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## kunalgujarathi (Oct 6, 2014)

Better go with Clevo then!
XoticPC Lifetime support is amazing!

It's a good machine with easy upgrade capability!


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## shubhamgarg55583 (Oct 6, 2014)

seamon said:


> Guess that sucks hardcore.



Yes, It's kinda a deal killer but There's Something About Dell!! 

Here, the updated chart. [Dell is scoring highest, i think i have to find a better way to rate  the configs :\ ]


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## seamon (Oct 6, 2014)

BTW 7200RPM drives are better than 5400RPM SSHDs.
Also, Clevo's build quality is easily better than MSI. Clevos are robust machines.

- - - Updated - - -

Basically, for Dell you are paying a premium for protection for a not so powerful machine.
Meanwhile, Clevo is all about raw power.


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## Siddhartht (Oct 6, 2014)

shubhamgarg55583 said:


> I gave it 5 points because of its selling point i.e. portability, similarly, dell has 5 points in warranty.
> 
> I just talked to a dell representative, I have to pay 5K extra for accidental damage warranty so the only thing i'll be getting covered is manufacturing faults.
> 
> ...



The problem with Dell and other first party notebook manufacturers is that they follow the guidelines laid by core hardware suppliers. They use MXM A slot, which is smaller. Also they follow notebook size guidelines for gpu selection, i.e. K3100M an up are available only for 17" models only.


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## seamon (Oct 6, 2014)

Siddhartht said:


> The problem with Dell and other first party notebook manufacturers is that they follow the guidelines laid by core hardware suppliers. They use MXM A slot, which is smaller. Also they follow notebook size guidelines for gpu selection, i.e. K3100M an up are available only for 17" models only.



Is that because the cooling mechanism of 15" Dell laptops is not good enough to handle K4100M/K5100M?


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## shubhamgarg55583 (Oct 6, 2014)

seamon said:


> BTW 7200RPM drives are better than 5400RPM SSHDs.
> Also, Clevo's build quality is easily better than MSI. Clevos are robust machines.
> 
> - - - Updated - - -
> ...



After a lot of searching I realized that Sager can be trusted with hardware.  [MENTION=248727]seamon[/MENTION] you're right, sager offers RAW power, but what good it is if it is not combined with equally powerful software support?!
I can not run LINUX smoothly on Sager Laptops. Even the customer Helpline declined to comment on linux. They don't offer support for linux.
Most of the physics research software I am longing to learn are linux based so Sager is definitely not an option. Driver support for Sager laptops in general is also not the best in the market.

So, I have narrowed it down to either Dell m4800 & MSI WS60 20J. 
As far as warranty goes, MSI is offering Accidental damage free of cost!


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## Siddhartht (Oct 6, 2014)

seamon said:


> Is that because the cooling mechanism of 15" Dell laptops is not good enough to handle K4100M/K5100M?



The schematics are actually top notch for cooling, maybe because they want the system to be completely stress free. 
Individual fans/heatsink/pipes for GPU/CPU with heat zone separation from motherboard.


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## seamon (Oct 7, 2014)

Maxwell mobile GTX series is here. Wait a little while for Maxwell mobile quadro.


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## Siddhartht (Oct 7, 2014)

seamon said:


> Maxwell mobile GTX series is here. Wait a little while for Maxwell mobile quadro.



I guess Maxwell K2200M is weeks not if months away. From Techpowerup GPU database, it seems like a Maxwell 860M with reduced clocks @ 128b bus. :/ I only wish that someday nvidia will try to really differentiate their Quadro and Geforce offering by additional hardware benefits, not just driver/software stability.


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## AbhMkh (Oct 7, 2014)

Much money, so Laptop !...WOW !


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## shubhamgarg55583 (Oct 8, 2014)

seamon said:


> Maxwell mobile GTX series is here. Wait a little while for Maxwell mobile quadro.



I can't wait for K2200M because even after weeks, Dell or any other company won't release that GPU in India. Even if some reputable company releases a laptop, I'll have to wait min 2 months for decent reviews and comments, so it's not worth it.  

I really wanna go for dell but I am worried about it's weight, 4.1Kg(with Adapter). 
MSI is at 2.6 Kg(with adapter) 

The battery life for both of them is more or less same.

- - - Updated - - -



AbhMkh said:


> Much money, so Laptop !...WOW !


Hell Yeah!


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## Siddhartht (Oct 8, 2014)

shubhamgarg55583 said:


> I can't wait for K2200M because even after weeks, Dell or any other company won't release that GPU in India. Even if some reputable company releases a laptop, I'll have to wait min 2 months for decent reviews and comments, so it's not worth it.
> 
> I really wanna go for dell but I am worried about it's weight, 4.1Kg(with Adapter).
> MSI is at 2.6 Kg(with adapter)
> ...



That is something you need to decide, build quality and heat management vs portability and looks(although MSI have more than average build)


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## shubhamgarg55583 (Oct 8, 2014)

Siddhartht said:


> That is something you need to decide, build quality and heat management vs portability and looks(although MSI have more than average build)



I have decided to go with dell, keeping in mind the back pain i'll probably get! 
Dell is more professional looking and durable and a lot more things. MSI has great looks but with something this flashy , I'll probably get bored in a month or two plus it wouldn't look nice during presentations & stuff like that...

So Dell it is! 

I am posting the specs below with the price information...Might be helpful for someone 

1 Intel Core i7-4810MQ Processor (Quad Core 2.80GHz, 3.80GHz Turbo, 6MB 47W, w/HD
1 39.6cm (15.6") UltraSharp FHD(1920x1080) Wide View Anti-Glare LED-backlit Premium Panel
Guarantee
1 SWIPE Fingerprint Reader and Smart Card Reader (Contact and Contactless) Palmrest,Dell
Precision M4800
1 Bezel cam/mic HD+/FHD
1 16GB 1600MHz DDR3L (2x8GB)
1 1TB 5400 rpm Hybrid Drive
1 8X DVD+/-RW Drive Tray Load
1 9-cell (97Wh) Lithium Ion battery with ExpressCharge
1 NVIDIA Quadro K2100M w/2GB GDDR5
1 Intel Dual Band Wireless-AC 7260 802.11ac/a/b/g/n 2x2 + Bluetooth 4.0 LE Half Mini Card
1 Internal US/International Qwerty Backlit Keyboard
1 Ubuntu Linux 12.04 SP1

Price: Rs.133756
[I am thinking of getting the windows too with Linux, so the final price will be more than this]

and guys, do you have any ideas if I can get a better deal than this?!

Anyways, a BIG THANK YOU for all of you guys [MENTION=284377]Siddhartht[/MENTION] [MENTION=248727]seamon[/MENTION] [MENTION=145143]SaiyanGoku[/MENTION] for your suggestions and advises! 
It helped me a lot and gotta love this forum!


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## SaiyanGoku (Oct 8, 2014)

shubhamgarg55583 said:


> I have decided to go with dell, keeping in mind the back pain i'll probably get!
> Dell is more professional looking and durable and a lot more things. MSI has great looks but with something this flashy , I'll probably get bored in a month or two plus it wouldn't look nice during presentations & stuff like that...
> 
> So Dell it is!
> ...



Ask them to a give an OEM copy of Windows 7 pro/Windows 8.1 pro free of cost. it doesn't costs them much considering they are giving a 5400 rpm HDD instead of a 7200 one at the price. also Linux Mint (based on ubuntu itself) is better than Ubuntu IMO


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## shubhamgarg55583 (Oct 8, 2014)

SaiyanGoku said:


> Ask them to a give an OEM copy of Windows 7 pro/Windows 8.1 pro free of cost. it doesn't costs them much considering they are giving a 5400 rpm HDD instead of a 7200 one at the price. also Linux Mint (based on ubuntu itself) is better than Ubuntu IMO



Okay, but will I be able to install Win10 later on if I go with OEM version? I read that it is fixed with the mobo.


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## SaiyanGoku (Oct 8, 2014)

shubhamgarg55583 said:


> Okay, but will I be able to install Win10 later on if I go with OEM version? I read that it is fixed with the mobo.



you should be able to. microsoft allowed win xp/vista users to migrate to win 8/8.1 for a discounted price. they won't deny win 7/8/8.1 users a win 10 upgrade.


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## $hadow (Oct 9, 2014)

And widows 10 upgrade is expected to be free of cost.


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## shubhamgarg55583 (Oct 9, 2014)

SaiyanGoku said:


> you should be able to. microsoft allowed win xp/vista users to migrate to win 8/8.1 for a discounted price. they won't deny win 7/8/8.1 users a win 10 upgrade.



Dell is not providing me the OEM Versiom, they are saying that they only keep the retail version. :/



$hadow said:


> And widows 10 upgrade is expected to be free of cost.



I think that was just a rumor...


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## $hadow (Oct 9, 2014)

shubhamgarg55583 said:


> Dell is not providing me the OEM Versiom, they are saying that they only keep the retail version. :/
> 
> 
> 
> I think that was just a rumor...



May be or may be not considering how bad windows 8 performed and along that Apple has also provided update for free this time.


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## SaiyanGoku (Oct 10, 2014)

shubhamgarg55583 said:


> Dell is not providing me the OEM Versiom, they are saying that they only keep the retail version. :/
> 
> I think that was just a rumor...



they can provide Windows 8.1 Single language free of cost with this POS Dell Inspiron 15 3541 Laptop worth 23k but not with a Workstation worth 135k 

- - - Updated - - -

quote this post when you reply them

Edit: Ubuntu 12.04 doesn't has a SP1  has dell India gone full retard or what?


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## shubhamgarg55583 (Oct 10, 2014)

> hey can provide Windows 8.1 Single language free of cost with this POS Dell Inspiron 15 3541 Laptop worth 23k but not with a Workstation worth 135k



not only this, I am not even getting accidental warranty FOC...-_-



> Ubuntu 12.04 doesn't has a SP1  has dell India gone full retard or what?



lol, I was wondering the same thing!


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## SaiyanGoku (Oct 11, 2014)

shubhamgarg55583 said:


> not only this, I am not even getting accidental warranty FOC...-_-
> 
> lol, I was wondering the same thing!



Have you quoted this post to them or not? ADP is subjective but they must provide Windows 8.1 (atleast single language) FOC because you already are paying a premium price for underpowered hardware, 135k. that clevo one got a price cut and the GTX 970m version now costs the same as previous GTX 870m version.


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## shubhamgarg55583 (Oct 11, 2014)

SaiyanGoku said:


> Have you quoted this post to them or not? ADP is subjective but they must provide Windows 8.1 (atleast single language) FOC because you already are paying a premium price for underpowered hardware, 135k. that clevo one got a price cut and the GTX 970m version now costs the same as previous GTX 870m version.



I'll do it when I talk to them on Monday. 
What's ADP?


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## SaiyanGoku (Oct 11, 2014)

shubhamgarg55583 said:


> I'll do it when I talk to them on Monday.
> What's ADP?



Accidental Damage Protection or accidental warranty.


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## abhigeek (Oct 12, 2014)

Even with my y510p ,i got ADP


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## shubhamgarg55583 (Oct 14, 2014)

Talked to Dell Rep today...Dell is not offering Windows or ADP or any other accessory(Mouse, Backpack, etc) Free with the laptop...
So I am going to buy Win8 Pro Student from MS store @Rs.3500 and a mouse ~@Rs.300


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