# El Jobso relaizes his developers arent as good



## iMav (Oct 17, 2007)

well he realized and knowing that third party developers are very important for success and couple that to the power of third party developers ... 



			
				el jobso said:
			
		

> *Let me just say it: *
> 
> We want native third party applications on the iPhone, and we plan to have an SDK in developers' hands in February. We are excited about creating a vibrant third party developer community around the iPhone and enabling hundreds of new applications for our users.
> 
> ...


*Source*


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## RCuber (Oct 17, 2007)

At last


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## gxsaurav (Oct 17, 2007)

At last....so, what was the statement El Jobso gave?

"We don't want AT&T's west cost network to go down due to some application"


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## aryayush (Oct 17, 2007)

I tell you this - iMav is a friggin' mystery to me.

This bit of news has not yet even hit the wire properly and he has already posted it! It's one thing for an Apple fanatic to follow the company obsessively but for a guy who is well known for disliking almost everything related to the company to do so is just insane.

I'm flabbergasted - honestly. These guys _hate_ Apple. (No need to pretend that you don't.) And yet they have installed the OS they hate on their PC and have been using it for many months now and they follow Apple's moves like a dog follows a biscuit. I've no clue how their brains work!
__________________________________________________

On topic: *Finally!*

Competition is a good thing indeed.


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## iMav (Oct 17, 2007)

for the record i dont hate apple i hate their software and the stupid decisions taken by the baldy at the helm


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## aryayush (Oct 17, 2007)

*Third Party Applications on the iPhone*

Oh, and someone does not know how to copy-paste stuff properly so that it is in a readable format. So here are the exact words, published as God intended them to be:





> *Third Party Applications on the iPhone*
> Let me just say it: We want native third party applications on the iPhone, and we plan to have an SDK in developers’ hands in February. We are excited about creating a vibrant third party developer community around the iPhone and enabling hundreds of new applications for our users. With our revolutionary multi-touch interface, powerful hardware and advanced software architecture, we believe we have created the best mobile platform ever for developers.
> 
> It will take until February to release an SDK because we’re trying to do two diametrically opposed things at once—provide an advanced and open platform to developers while at the same time protect iPhone users from viruses, malware, privacy attacks, etc. This is no easy task. Some claim that viruses and malware are not a problem on mobile phones—this is simply not true. There have been serious viruses on other mobile phones already, including some that silently spread from phone to phone over the cell network. As our phones become more powerful, these malicious programs will become more dangerous. And since the iPhone is the most advanced phone ever, it will be a highly visible target.
> ...


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## iMav (Oct 17, 2007)

ok so where is the difference


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## aryayush (Oct 17, 2007)

iMav said:
			
		

> for the record i dont hate apple i hate their software and the stupid decisions taken by the baldy at the helm


Yeah, well - that "baldy" _is_ Apple. And I thought I expressly mentioned that there is...





			
				aryayush said:
			
		

> No need to pretend that you don't.





			
				iMav said:
			
		

> ok so where is the difference


People who care can spot the difference a mile away.


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## gxsaurav (Oct 17, 2007)

> People who care can spot the difference a mile away.


 
Can;t u see iMav, arya made the UI of the paragraph look good


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## DigitalDude (Oct 17, 2007)

gx_saurav said:
			
		

> Can;t u see iMav, arya made the UI of the paragraph look good


 
rofl


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## superczar (Oct 17, 2007)

> And yet they have installed the OS they hate on their PC and have been using it for many months now



oh, i get it now....
Am not exactly sure of the current status of running OS X on non Apple x86 hardware, but from what I remember, it isn't very pleasant because of driver issues and conflicts

perhaps that explains the mystery


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## iMav (Oct 17, 2007)

aa that sorry gizmodo had it like that and put it ... was in a hurry


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## goobimama (Oct 18, 2007)

I tell you. "Why do iMav and gx use OS X"  is a bigger mystery than the everlong philosophical question: Why are we here. No technologist, econimist, psychiatrist, foot surgeon can ever come up with an answer to that... 

Now, for the SDK, yippee!!! And it will be just in time for when the iPhone is introduced in India!

I liked the artwork on gizmodo though:
*gizmodo.com/assets/resources/2007/10/sdk.jpeg



			
				gx_saurav said:
			
		

> Can;t u see iMav, arya made the UI of the paragraph look good



Another big mystery is your obsession for all things ugly. What is wrong with properly aligned paragraphs, well spaced typeface, and other things that go with the word 'beauty'?


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## iMav (Oct 18, 2007)

superczar said:
			
		

> oh, i get it now....
> Am not exactly sure of the current status of running OS X on non Apple x86 hardware, but from what I remember, it isn't very pleasant because of driver issues and conflicts
> 
> perhaps that explains the mystery


 there are driver isues but but on my basic machine there isnt hardware that conflicts or doesnt have appropriate mac drivers


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## gxsaurav (Oct 18, 2007)

goobimama said:
			
		

> I tell you. "Why do iMav and gx use OS X"  is a bigger mystery than the everlong philosophical question: Why are we here. No technologist, econimist, psychiatrist, foot surgeon can ever come up with an answer to that...



I use it for my workstation apps some of which are Mac only. Such as FCP & Shake. I don't even use it for anything else.



> Another big mystery is your obsession for all things ugly. What is wrong with properly aligned paragraphs, well spaced typeface, and other things that go with the word 'beauty'?



Its not that I like ugly things, its the way arya said "the difference" when it is only aligned paragraph


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## iMav (Oct 18, 2007)

o my freakin lord paragraphs are such an issue i wonder how do i even read the news paper or the magazines ..... o! ya i know u dont even read them u just look at the images .... and if the images are good then the mag is good ... raaabo fat being are u reading ... if u ever come up with a mac version put only images .... text doesnt matter .... 

PS: i thought p0rn pix are the ones that dont need any sort of text but yeah as in *massachusetts*  some ppl just get horny by the hardware pix


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## superczar (Oct 18, 2007)

> there are driver isues but but on my basic machine there isnt hardware that conflicts or doesnt have appropriate mac drivers


what setup are you running it on?


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## iMav (Oct 18, 2007)

intel 865gbf
nvidia fx 5200
p4 3G
512 ddr


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## superczar (Oct 18, 2007)

865gbf is fully supported ?
and what core is that P4?

Anyway, on a completely different note, I have tremendous respect for that _can do- will do _attitude when it comes to pulling workarounds when it comes to technology 

been there-done that, esp when I was a budget constrained student.....
However, I find it increasingly difficult to spend time to such pursuits these days though (with notable exceptions like my latest carputer build)

Anyway, the tangential story apart, I somehow feel that the beauty of OS X (that lies in the fact that it *simply works*) is lost when you embark on a project like the osx86 , i.e. running OS X on non apple- non TPM hardware

With non apple harware without a TPM, there will be some or the other niggles here & there... a missing driver, some API call conflicts, maybe a few IRQ conflicts.....a nag here or there...and that kills the very reason OS X users love it for


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## iMav (Oct 18, 2007)

single core ... and ya i guess its fully supported ... i installed using my onboard gfx adapter and my sound is working so ya its supported


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## superczar (Oct 18, 2007)

no no....when I said core, I meant Prescott/williamette/Northwood and the ilk


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## alsiladka (Oct 18, 2007)

Man, poor AT&T network, its gonna come down so quickly now. Damn the 3rd party apps. Uhh Mr.Job, why the sudden turnaround?

Although the move is excellant, but why the hell so late? Didnt they trust their product to do well without it, or rather as they had though it would?


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## iMav (Oct 18, 2007)

prescott


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## superczar (Oct 18, 2007)

actually you replied while i was editing my previous post, 
and the thread scrolled over to the next page
was waiting to hear back from you on these thoughts...



> Anyway, on a completely different note, I have tremendous respect for that can do- will do attitude when it comes to pulling workarounds when it comes to technology
> 
> been there-done that, esp when I was a budget constrained student.....
> However, I find it increasingly difficult to spend time to such pursuits these days though (with notable exceptions like my latest carputer build)
> ...


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## iMav (Oct 18, 2007)

ya well its just blah blah an excuse to try and convince a lot of ppl who tried os x on non apple machines and decided to turn away form purchasing an apple product at the same time i do agree that os x is tuned for specific hardware much like dell or hp who a lot of times tune hardware drivers to suit their machines but im not saying that os x is faulty at the core (my level computer knowledge forbids me from doing so) however i can comment on what the os x has to offer and the way it works and that will not change whether i use an apple machine or a normal pc which basically is from the same hardware  and using it on my machine i can try out almost every apple software out there ya iv even dwnldd the crappy iwork 08


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## aryayush (Oct 18, 2007)

alsiladka said:
			
		

> Man, poor AT&T network, its gonna come down so quickly now. Damn the 3rd party apps. Uhh Mr.Job, why the sudden turnaround?
> 
> Although the move is excellant, but why the hell so late? Didnt they trust their product to do well without it, or rather as they had though it would?


I am pretty sure that an official SDK for the iPhone has been in the works ever since the beginning. They just wanted to keep it a surprise and only announce it (with a huge event or something) when it was finished. But the pressure from the hackers and customers mounted so much that the iPhone's reputation was taking a hit. So Steve decided to let people know that it is in the works and is coming soon.

That's my theory anyway. 



			
				iMav said:
			
		

> ya well its just blah blah an excuse to try and convince a lot of ppl who tried os x on non apple machines and decided to turn away form purchasing an apple product at the same time i do agree that os x is tuned for specific hardware much like dell or hp who a lot of times tune hardware drivers to suit their machines but im not saying that os x is faulty at the core (my level computer knowledge forbids me from doing so) however i can comment on what the os x has to offer and the way it works and that will not change whether i use an apple machine or a normal pc which basically is from the same hardware  and using it on my machine i can try out almost every apple software out there ya iv even dwnldd the crappy iwork 08


@superczar
Basically, they are forced to stick with Windows for one reason or the other and therefore, they don't like the fact that Mac OS X is better so they keep cribbing about it to make themselves feel better.

If you'd known them and read the utter bullshit they post for as long as I've done, you'd know that I speak the truth.

Anyway, let's move on to better topics. This is very controversial.


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## iMav (Oct 18, 2007)

we are forced to use windows  man where are those laughing smileys  we are forced  any 1 tell u the options and flexibility pc uses have as compared to mac boys   we are forced


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## goobimama (Oct 18, 2007)

@gx: Yes. Aligned paragraphs make all the difference. If they didn't, then wedding invitations would look like a newspaper. And all book covers would be some plain paper with the title written in bad handwriting. Typography is what makes design work. If it (among other design elements) didn't, there wouldn't be a job for a designer....

Mods, please remove this 'theme' for the forum. The winboys seem to want ugly times new roman typeface with no proper organisation for posts or anything else. Ugly is the best way to go...


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## alsiladka (Oct 18, 2007)

aryayush said:
			
		

> I am pretty sure that an official SDK for the iPhone has been in the works ever since the beginning. They just wanted to keep it a surprise and only announce it (with a huge event or something) when it was finished. But the pressure from the hackers and customers mounted so much that the iPhone's reputation was taking a hit. So Steve decided to let people know that it is in the works and is coming soon.


 
What would you like to say to this comment then if they were working on the SDK from the start (which i believe they did) - 


> "We don't want AT&T's west cost network to go down due to some application"


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## gxsaurav (Oct 18, 2007)

aryayush said:
			
		

> I am pretty sure that an official SDK for the iPhone has been in the works ever since the beginning. They just wanted to keep it a surprise and only announce it (with a huge event or something) when it was finished. But the pressure from the hackers and customers mounted so much that the iPhone's reputation was taking a hit. So Steve decided to let people know that it is in the works and is coming soon.



Assuming your theory is correct, then Steve Jobs is a big liar . First her said there is no SDK required & it doesn't exist, Web 2.0 apps are the way to go....& now he is saying that there will be a SDK, Steve Jobs can't be trusted anymore.



> Basically, they are forced to stick with Windows for one reason or the other and therefore,



Did u say "forced". Its u who is forces to use Mac the way it exists. Can't change the colour theme, Icon font, menubar colour.....we both can install whatever X86 OS we like on our machine, whether pirated or legal, whose forced here?


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## superczar (Oct 18, 2007)

> Can't change the colour theme, Icon font, menubar colour....



thats' thanks to your ignorance...


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## goobimama (Oct 18, 2007)

> colour theme, Icon font, menubar colour


What are we eight? It would be a different story if the whole thing looked ugly, but if the design elements are carefully selected then why would I want to change them? Of course, in your case, you like things ugly, that's why you need the menubar to be changed to a hideous blue and the apple button to a painful green....


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## superczar (Oct 18, 2007)

thats besides the point goobi...
The UI elements can be edited to whatever you like them to be..

Actually root access on terminal in OS X give you a far more logical and granular level of control on OS X than the layered access in windows can ever give....

It's just that it's not dummies friendly and it requires good knowledge of OS X internals to tweak your way around on a Mac


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## iMav (Oct 18, 2007)

and a higher risk of crashing the OS itself


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## gxsaurav (Oct 18, 2007)

superczar said:
			
		

> thats' thanks to your ignorance...


 
Wow....plz do show me a way in Mac OS X itself, like in Windows "Desktop Properties" to change the icon scheme, colour theme, menubar transparency & colour etc....speak about something which makes sense.



> Actually root access on terminal in OS X give you a far more logical and granular level of control on OS X than the layered access in windows can ever give....
> 
> It's just that it's not dummies friendly and it requires good knowledge of OS X internals to tweak your way around on a Mac


 
And thats the point, Windows makes it so easy to change the UI elements for use, that we can tweak windows 95% to our liking. But in case of Mac OS X, we have to use what Apple wants us to use.

Gray Blend UI in 2007, ewww ewww


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## aryayush (Oct 18, 2007)

Let me tell you this, Leopard looks far sexier then Vista can ever hope to.


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## Pathik (Oct 18, 2007)

Just used a iPhone..
With the kind of features it has, you can only be excited about it and its UI for about 20 minutes..
After that you need solid features to keep urself interested... or atleast good 3rd party apps.. wich r currently a lil less in number..
but 1 thing..
MULTITOUCH simply rocks..


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## aryayush (Oct 18, 2007)

Let me guess, you did not get to use Safari and the iPod did not have a lot of properly tagged music (with album art) on it.


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## gxsaurav (Oct 18, 2007)

aryayush said:
			
		

> Let me tell you this, Leopard looks far sexier then Vista can ever hope to.


 
Lolz...thats what u think....uxtheme.dll FTW, or Vista + Vize


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## alsiladka (Oct 18, 2007)

aryayush said:
			
		

> Let me guess, you did not get to use Safari and the iPod did not have a lot of properly tagged music (with album art) on it.


 
Chalo, lets add 1, nah 2 hours of more great fun to that. Will you use the iPhone to surf everytime when you have the access to computers?

And would you keep flipping through the cover flow all the time and select individual songs from your beautifully arranged library or opt for playlists and keep the iphone in your pocket while listening to music?



			
				aryayush said:
			
		

> Let me tell you this, Leopard looks far sexier then Vista can ever hope to.


 
Use Windowblinds with some creative skins.


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## Pathik (Oct 18, 2007)

Yup Safari is really good..
If i get a chance i ll also try it out wit my college wifi..
and Coverflow doesnt interest me much as i m not a music fan..
the sound quality really rocks thru the earphones... 
and Its got a real high SHOWOFF quotient..


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## aryayush (Oct 18, 2007)

So, what _didn't_ you like about the phone?



			
				alsiladka said:
			
		

> Use Windowblinds with some creative skins.


That can only change the look of the OS (which is not too bad by default anyway). It still will have the counter-intuitive user interface it has.



			
				alsiladka said:
			
		

> Chalo, lets add 1, nah 2 hours of more great fun to that. Will you use the iPhone to surf everytime when you have the access to computers?
> 
> And would you keep flipping through the cover flow all the time and select individual songs from your beautifully arranged library or opt for playlists and keep the iphone in your pocket while listening to music?


So, on other phones, you keep video recording for twenty hours everyday?

The UI is the one thing that you have to use each time you use the phone and the iPhone has the best UI in the world.


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## iMav (Oct 18, 2007)

kya hua arya ... public opinion going against ur choice ... making u nervous ...  u didnt get to use safari toh safari use kareke kaunsa pahad hil jayega  no album art on ipod   man a hectic day and some aryaness ... the day is complete


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## gxsaurav (Oct 18, 2007)

alsiladka said:
			
		

> Chalo, lets add 1, nah 2 hours of more great fun to that. Will you use the iPhone to surf everytime when you have the access to computers?
> 
> And would you keep flipping through the cover flow all the time and select individual songs from your beautifully arranged library or opt for playlists and keep the iphone in your pocket while listening to music?


 
Arya & other macboys will opt to surf net on such a small screen & not use Safari on there Mac, & will flip through the cover flow all the time and select individual songs from there beautifully arranged library becuse just look at the UI, it looks so cool 



> Use Windowblinds with some creative skins.


 
I did not wanted to include this cos this is a 3rd party apps. Despite of that, compared to Vista, Leopard gives nothing to the user to customize the UI. Hack, it won't even allow me to make the Apple menu opeque again cos I don't like it transparent. Even hacks using input managers won't work.


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## aryayush (Oct 18, 2007)

This is something I once wrote:





> Now that that is out of the way (the information about the iPhone's price being lowered, that is), here's my main question - do you intend to puchase the iPhone now? Please say no. Remember that it still has crippled Bluetooth functionality, no video recording capabilities, no 3G... and a lot of other drawbacks. You don't want it. The lower price is just a lure - resist it! C'mon, you can do it. Grab a RAZR or something instead.


So, believe me, I couldn't be happier by the news that people are not liking the iPhone. I don't want it to be like the iPod. I want it to be like Macs. (I know that is impossible though. This is one device that is destined for greatness and the evil that is attached to it - ubiquity. )


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## gxsaurav (Oct 18, 2007)

> So, what _didn't_ you like about the phone?


 
Plz have a look at the Official iPhone thread for answers to this question  



> Please say no. Remember that it still has crippled Bluetooth functionality, no video recording capabilities, *no 3G*... and a lot of other drawbacks.


 
Wasen't it u who replied to me once when I said "Where is 3G"...& your reply was "chatega kya"


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## aryayush (Oct 18, 2007)

I just randomly picked up three of its oft-mentioned drawbacks, two of which are not drawbacks IMHO. Stop being stupid. It will help you in life.


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## superczar (Oct 18, 2007)

> Just used a iPhone..
> With the kind of features it has, you can only be excited about it and its UI for about 20 minutes..
> After that you need solid features to keep urself interested... or atleast good 3rd party apps.. wich r currently a lil less in number..
> but 1 thing..
> MULTITOUCH simply rocks..


 There's no point buying an iphone if you don't have (or don't want to pay for )  GPRS...period....

I'd rather have PC like access to the net on Safari than any random one time usage "feature"



> Wow....plz do show me a way in Mac OS X itself, like in Windows "Desktop Properties" to change the icon scheme, colour theme, menubar transparency & colour etc....speak about something which makes sense.



You, my dear friend, need to get a crash course in reading & comprehension skills 

Did you even bother to read my post (#33), or was it incomprehensible?

There is absolutely no need for OS X to have an easy to use customization way for the themes...the original is fairly good....
If however, you still want to have a go at it, get a knack of the OS internals....

Seriously guys..there is nothing like a nice and healthy debate....
but it gets pointless when some of the people in the fray behave (hopefully intentionally) like nitwits


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## iMav (Oct 18, 2007)

blah blah and blah ...

heres a crash ocurse in foruming based on some posts by mac boys

when out of words and nearly pwned what should u say ..... the other guy is an idiot and doesnt understand english


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## superczar (Oct 18, 2007)

^^ oh man...that seriously cracked me up....


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## iMav (Oct 18, 2007)

ya i got that effect on ppl


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## gxsaurav (Oct 18, 2007)

superczar said:
			
		

> There's no point buying an iphone if you don't have (or don't want to pay for )  GPRS...period....
> 
> I'd rather have PC like access to the net on Safari than any random one time usage "feature"



GPRS....GPRS....GPRS in 2007, u sure u r not going back in TIME? World is moving towards 4G. EDGE is available only in few cities of India & GPRS is hack slow, due to which loading big webpages is a PITA....however with Opera Mini, een pages like MySpace (worst HTML ever) open in a ziffy even on GPRS.



> There is absolutely no need for OS X to have an easy to use customization way for the themes...the original is fairly good....
> If however, you still want to have a go at it, get a knack of the OS internals....



Lolz...this is where Windows Vista kicks the arse of Mac OS X. You can make Windows look like whatever u want, but u can't make Mac OS X look anything other then...well...Mac. Have a look at this screenshots, I can make Vista look & work like Mac OS X, but can't make Mac's UI even 10% different.

*img156.imageshack.us/img156/1264/windowsvistalikemacosxsa4.th.jpg

People have subjective choices, U like gray UI, I like slight black UI, can I change in Mac OS X? no...can I do that in Windows, yup.

Can I change in Mac OS X without screwing the OS internals, no. 

Can I change in vista without screwing the OS internals, Yup..

Logically, Vista is better.


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## goobimama (Oct 18, 2007)

We know everyone wants their desktop to look like a mac. But what was that, that great person once said?

Even if a goat wears the skin of a tiger (well, maybe a leopard in future), it is still a goat under there...


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## superczar (Oct 18, 2007)

> GPRS....GPRS....GPRS in 2007, u sure u r not going back in TIME? World is moving towards 4G. EDGE is available only in few cities of India & GPRS is hack slow, due to which loading big webpages is a PITA....however with Opera Mini, een pages like MySpace (worst HTML ever) open in a ziffy even on GPRS.


I get between 100-120kbps on Edge in chennai which is more than fast enough for browsing and even youtube app works without any buffering 
delays (try guessing how?)

3G isn't mature as yet, and most current 3G chips fast deplete the battery (not that 3G is available anywhere in India anyway)
which brings us back to the original point
It's better having an eminently usable feature than some technical kick a$$ feature that is practically useless

Last month, I was using 3G UMTS on O2 deutschland on my N73ME
45 mins of replying back to e-mails and the battery was down from full to 50%....

It's better to have a 2 second load time on my mail account with a full day of usage instead of a 1 second load time but sub 2 hours of usage time




> People have subjective choices, U like gray UI, I like slight black UI, can I change in Mac OS X? no...can I do that in Windows, yup.
> 
> Can I change in Mac OS X without screwing the OS internals, no.
> 
> Can I change in vista without screwing the OS internals, Yup..


 Thats why i keep saying it's your lack of knowledge of OS X that prevents you from tweaking OS X...
Ever heard of something called plist files?

anyway, why don't you compare substantial and meaningful stuff like the relative stability of the systems than something as frivolous as this?


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## gxsaurav (Oct 18, 2007)

superczar said:
			
		

> It's better having an eminently usable feature than some technical kick a$$ feature that is practically useless


 
Yup, its better to use Opera Mini to open orkut in 5kb then safari to open orkut in 57kb 



> Ever heard of something called plist files?


 
Nope, Why should I need to know that? I m so used to the Windows method of right clicking on the desktop ->personalize-> & changing whatever I want using simple & easy methods instead of resource hacking.

And hey, do tell me if you can make the leopard's Apple menu back to opeque like Tiger... I would really appriciate that.



> anyway, why don't you compare substantial and meaningful stuff like the relative stability of the systems than something as frivolous as this?


 
Apple makes the hardware & software. They are tightly packed together. U cannot install a 3rd party TV Tuner in Mac Pro & use Windows to use view TV in it, neither u can upgrade the graphics card by buying one from the market. 

Obviously if a system is so closed, it will be rock stable. When was the last time u saw kernel panic or BSD on a XBOX 360 or PS3 (closed hardware)...

Windows on the other hand supports so much hardware & software configurations, that driver manufacturer many times don't go for WHQL which might or might not lead to an unstable driver. Show me one BSD ever with WHQL drivers plz..


*WE ARE DEVIATING FROM THE TOPIC...Back to normality plz*


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## goobimama (Oct 18, 2007)

> Obviously if a system is so closed, it will be rock stable


I'm so glad you finally got one thing right! This is what I've been trying to say from the beginning.


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## superczar (Oct 18, 2007)

> Yup, its better to use Opera Mini to open orkut in 5kb then safari to open orkut in 57kb



What? Opera mini vs Safari on the iphone...sorry, That is an appalling comparison (Is win 3.1 better than XP?) ...I'd rather not even dwelve into it



> Apple makes the hardware & software. They are tightly packed together. U cannot install a 3rd party TV Tuner in Mac Pro & use Windows to use view TV in it, neither u can upgrade the graphics card by buying one from the market.


I don't use a desktop and I am used to limited upgrade choices
I don't think though that a Mac Pro would not let you upgrade RAM or the HDD or the gfx card... Goobi, Arya, any comments?


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## Pathik (Oct 18, 2007)

@superczar the EDGe in mumbai (be it Airtel or Voda) sucks... the max speeds offered are around 36-40 kbps.. and even tho safari is a really good browser it doesnt offer much with these speeds..


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## superczar (Oct 18, 2007)

what phone you trying it on?


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## gxsaurav (Oct 18, 2007)

superczar said:
			
		

> What? Opera mini vs Safari on the iphone...sorry, That is an appalling comparison (Is win 3.1 better than XP?) ...I'd rather not even dwelve into it


 
Lolz...tell me something I can't fo on my K750i using Opera Mini, which over all costs only 10K, in iPhone of 40k+




> I don't use a desktop and I am used to limited upgrade choices


 
All Mac users are.


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## superczar (Oct 18, 2007)

> Lolz...tell me something I can't fo on my K750i using Opera Mini, which over all costs only 10K, in iPhone of 40k+


Hahaha...that's like saying I can even browse on Lynx....
or what use a car...I can reach from bangalore to Chennai on a cycle too

BTW whatever gave you the impression the iphone is 40K...check my sig 

And no, I am not used to limited upgrade choices because of being a Mac user...It's just that I  love portability on my devices...

check my rigs here....predominantly Windows....
*www.techenclave.com/forums/rig/viewgallery-35.html

I don't hate windows, its just that I prefer the ease of use of a Mac

hard-core tweaking of my rigs...deep regediting/nliting...done it all...just that now I have fallen into a phase where I just want my stuff to work without too much of a headache....


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## gxsaurav (Oct 18, 2007)

superczar said:
			
		

> Hahaha...that's like saying I can even browse on Lynx....
> or what use a car...I can reach from bangalore to Chennai on a cycle too



Dude, u make me laugh. MobileSafari does provides everything, but on a 3 inch screen with a pay-per-kb data plan, Atleast I would prefer Opera Mini, where I not only have to download less data but can also disable images etc...


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## superczar (Oct 18, 2007)

I have used opera mini on my N73me more than enough times to know what its capabilities are....
and there are enough affordable unlimited plans on most Telcos to not keep a tab on my data usage...

Here is the deal...when I had no choice but to use Opera Mini, I would use it only when absolutely absolutely necessary....
With Safari, I use the phone for random browsing too as I would on a PC


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## din (Oct 18, 2007)

gx_saurav said:
			
		

> ... a pay-per-kb data plan



Offtopic : Airtel offers unliminted GPRS / EDGE for Rs.125 a month, I think it worth. We have to pay it advance, that is Rs.1500 one yr. Also not sure whether it is available all over India. I am using that.


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## goobimama (Oct 18, 2007)

Can I ask one thing. Do any of you mobile phone users of the K-whatever, actually surf the net using the web browser? Cause my friend's have these Ks and Ws, but none of them ever surf using the web browser even though they did try to once with the GPRS. 

The iPhone really does make browsing like on a computer, with it's multi touch display. The way of working with web pages is totally out of this world. Plus, it has WiFi.


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## superczar (Oct 18, 2007)

exactly what I am saying Goobi:



> Here is the deal...when I had no choice but to use Opera Mini, I would use it only when absolutely absolutely necessary....
> With Safari, I use the phone for random browsing too as I would on a PC


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## gxsaurav (Oct 18, 2007)

din said:
			
		

> Offtopic : Airtel offers unliminted GPRS / EDGE for Rs.125 a month, I think it worth. We have to pay it advance, that is Rs.1500 one yr. Also not sure whether it is available all over India. I am using that.


 
That I know, but a BSNL user here. I get the top up coupans for free , but GPRS isn't unltd on prepaid



> Do any of you mobile phone users of the K-whatever, actually surf the net using the web browser?


 
Yup, I was using Opera Mini 3.0 full time when i was in gurgaon, my friend uses Opera for Mobile on his Nokia 5700 in Gurgaon full time for everything.



> The iPhone really does make browsing like on a computer, with it's multi touch display. The way of working with web pages is totally out of this world. Plus, it has WiFi.


 
My K750i does more work then the iPhone, & mine was released 2 years ago. Why don't u compare iPhone with W960i


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## superczar (Oct 18, 2007)

Gx_saurav
the idea is I don't need to as I already have.....
I have already run a comparison review between the iphone, the N73ME (Symbian) and ipaq 6365 (win mobile) which is posted in the reviews section

It is you who needs to get hold of one to do a comparison
basing your opinion (and a very stron one at that) simply on the basis of hearsay isn't a good idea


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## aryayush (Oct 19, 2007)

Oh, believe me, even if he uses the iPhone for a month, he'll still publicly say he hates it. (We all know the truth though.)

He's the oh-I'm-so-cool-I-pretend-to-hate-the-company-everyone-loves type!


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## gxsaurav (Oct 19, 2007)

superczar said:
			
		

> It is you who needs to get hold of one to do a comparison
> basing your opinion (and a very stron one at that) simply on the basis of hearsay isn't a good idea


 
Like alsiladka said, what good is a UI if the phone can't do things I expect a phone to do.


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## iMav (Oct 19, 2007)

aryayush said:
			
		

> He's the oh-I'm-so-cool-I-pretend-to-hate-the-company-everyone-loves


 how different are u


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## superczar (Oct 19, 2007)

> Like alsiladka said, what good is a UI if the phone can't do things I expect a phone to do.


 And what do you want your phone to do...cook dinner for you ? 

_vaise _this discussion keep running in circles all the time


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## din (Oct 19, 2007)

@superczar

LOL, man, if you own iPhone, then you are not suitable for discussing iPhone here 

Reason is, another 'Official iPhone thread' is there in this section, where none of the participants ever used an iPhone !

Isn't it amazing ? It happens only @ thinkdigit forum


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## infra_red_dude (Oct 19, 2007)

din said:
			
		

> Reason is, another 'Official iPhone thread' is there in this section, where none of the participants ever used an iPhone !
> 
> Isn't it amazing ? It happens only @ thinkdigit forum


Cudn't haf said it better!  Opinions here are made not by experience but by observation!


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## iMav (Oct 19, 2007)

ya well im waiting for that day wen im so freakin rich that i can buy gadgets to test and then throw if i dont like .... but alas until i have to base my decisions on my super-natural observation skills ...


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## din (Oct 19, 2007)

@iMav - 100% agree with you again 

Provided you read or understand things from someone who *really used / experienced *a gadget.

Read these (no need to mention who posted these, but at any cost, don't use your *super-natural observation skills* based on those lol)



> My K750i does more work then the iPhone, & mine was released 2 years ago.



Anyone reading it will think, WOW, this guy own iPhone and thats based on his own experience.



> And thats the point, Windows makes it so easy to change the UI elements for use, that we can tweak windows 95% to our liking. But in case of Mac OS X, we have to use what Apple wants us to use.



Which make others think - WOW he own a mac too 

From another thread ..



> Zune Product range is Awesome.. just use them and i mean use it once and you will forget anything else..



Only Goobi n myself were sure he does not own a Zune 

There are a lot of comments like this. Buy that, thats the best thing in the world, do not buy some other thing, thats the worst thing etc etc. What I meant is, when we can't buy-and-test each and everything, rely on some un-biased reviews by someone who really own the product. May be some sites which are good for un-biased reviews and which are there for quite a long time. 

In case of iPhone, there were many nice reviews posted in internet by people who *used it* which listed the positive and negative points of iPhones. And the famous thinkdigit forum - official iPhone thread ?

No problem in posting some links or copy pasting some other blog content - as buying is not always possible, but what I do not understand is, making statements that sounds like - "Man, never go for it, it sux" or " Go ahead, and grab it". Post reviews or post comments but please do not post something that sounds like you own something and your statements are based on your own experience.

Atleast add a 'default statement' whenever we post, something like - *My statements are not based on my experience, in fact I do not own the peroduct at all*

The forum will be very useful if we all share our experience instead of copy pasting from other sites. Like if I buy a new mobile and from my experience if it sux, then I can warn others and atleast people who read can stay away from it. Instaed, how it will be if I post about that mobile 2 pages full and every point is biased and in favor of it and tempting others to buy - even before I buy that mobile but my post sounds like I have that mobile for ages? Which will be better ?

Enough, I am hungry, goin for lunch !


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## praka123 (Oct 19, 2007)

u hit the point @Din  add this for gx_saurav too.


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## superczar (Oct 19, 2007)

^ one of the most sensible posts that I have seen around here


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## iMav (Oct 19, 2007)

hey im not copy pasting stuff im reading from God knows how many sites and ya they talk abt the good and the bad btw why is it always that the windows supporters are the 1s who need to use things do this do that where as linux users and mac boys are heaven sent angels who know all do all own all ....

i think and im pretty honestly saying this the un-necessary windows bashing that is done alll over is the reason why these things happen ... ur o! the iphone just rocks when it lacks basic features o! os x just so easy to use when u cant change a theme without messing with the core files is just plain stupid and the windows users are dumb they know nothing and can do nothing attitude is absurd and once some windows users start retaliating and make solid reasoning that u guys start making comments like o! the other guy is an idiot he cant understand this and that and all sorts of non-sense

when a windows user says there is no drm content here in india its like it will come and wen we say there is no hd-dvd support its like there is no hd-dvd availble ....


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## infra_red_dude (Oct 19, 2007)

superczar said:
			
		

> ^ one of the most sensible posts that I have seen around here


Tch... Tch.. Naah.. the *ONLY *sensible post!


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## din (Oct 19, 2007)

Please do not make it like a win-mac-lin fight.

I never meant that and I have no plan to do that.

What I meant is, either post from very reliable, un-biased review site links, details etc or post from our own experience or do not post at all (there is nothing like I will lose my username in digit if I do not reply for a post). If we are posting based on some other review or some comments from our friend, kindly mention it is not based on our own experience, coz many posts sounds like we used the gadget !

And @iMav

You are a very nice person, to be frank, I do not remember you posted any content that you commented like you own something but in real you do not. That is really nice of you. I am wondering why all others are not like that ?


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## infra_red_dude (Oct 19, 2007)

iMav said:
			
		

> hey im not copy pasting stuff im reading from God knows how many sites and ya they talk abt the good and the bad btw why is it always that the windows supporters are the 1s who need to use things do this do that where as linux users and mac boys are heaven sent angels who know all do all own all ....


 I'm sorry I did not understand a single word in this para!



			
				iMav said:
			
		

> i think and im pretty honestly saying this the un-necessary windows bashing that is done alll over is the reason why these things happen ...


 You mean to say that Windows is being bashed in some thread and the retaliation by the Winboys is in some other thread??



			
				iMav said:
			
		

> ur o! the iphone just rocks when it lacks basic features


 Bhai mere, nobody says "The iPhone rocks!" I've only heard people say that the multitouch is cool, the screen is brilliant, the UI is snappy. I think thats about it and I don't think somebody's ever said: "No MMS rocks!" or "No Video recording rocks!" (Those sentences don't make sense, anyways!  )



			
				iMav said:
			
		

> o! os x just so easy to use when u cant change a theme without messing with the core files is just plain stupid


 Being easy to use and changing a theme are miles apart from each other and haf no connection. 



			
				iMav said:
			
		

> and the windows users are dumb they know nothing and can do nothing attitude is absurd


 It is wrong to say such things. I agree on this. I'm with you as I myself am a Windows user too.



			
				iMav said:
			
		

> and once some windows users start retaliating and make *solid reasoning* ....


 Thats a fictitious entity! 



			
				iMav said:
			
		

> when a windows user says there is no drm content here in india its like it will come and wen we say there is no hd-dvd support its like there is no hd-dvd availble ....


 If you read about DRM, you will see that it encompases a broader range of things. Again, the comparisons you give here DRM and HD-DVD are not logical. 

See, DRM will stay. If today we don't get to see much DRM content in India tomorrow we may, we can't say anything for sure. However, today we don't don't haf much HD-DVD content but tomorrow, again, we may. What makes you think that its the EOL (End of life) of Macs and Linux and that these are the final versions and there will not be a single feature added in the coming months.

Necessity is the mother of all inventions. When HD-DVD will be popular every device will support it. Nobody can afford to NOT support it and still survive in the market. I hope you get my point.

This applies to Apple as well. Necessity is the mother of all inventions and that led it to announce that there will be an SDK for 3rd party developers. It was necessary for them to allow 3rd Party apps.


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## iMav (Oct 19, 2007)

infra ....  smart ....

as i have told earlier also .... in another thread ... a crash course in foruming ... when have nothing to say just say hey i dont understand and ur an idiot  i know i know


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## infra_red_dude (Oct 19, 2007)

iMav said:
			
		

> why is it always that the windows supporters are the 1s who need to use things do this do that where as linux users and mac boys are heaven sent angels who know all do all own all ....


I seriously did not understand a thing in the above excerpt.


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## gxsaurav (Oct 19, 2007)

infra_red_dude said:
			
		

> I think thats about it and I don't think somebody's ever said: "No MMS rocks!" or "No Video recording rocks!"



Plz have a look at what arya is saying .



> Necessity is the mother of all inventions. When HD-DVD will be popular every device will support it. Nobody can afford to NOT support it and still survive in the market. I hope you get my point.



How will arya use a HD DVD on his Macbook, or goobi on his iMac? They can use external drives, but still due to lack of HDCP they can't view HD Content on there Macs, & they also can't upgrade the graphics card to a new model with HDCP.


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## iMav (Oct 19, 2007)

why is it always that the windows supporters are the 1s who need to use things, do this, do that, where as linux users and mac boys are heaven sent angels who - know all, do all, own all .... damn its a pain to insert commas


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## infra_red_dude (Oct 19, 2007)

@GX
I think I've said it before that by the time HD DVD will become common people would've upgraded their PCs and even Macs. You know how long it took for the DVDs to be accepted by the home consumer inspite of their entry in the PC Domain much earlier.

Regarding the features where iPhone I think he is the only person who said that No Video rocks. At least in all the reviews I've read "no video recording" has been criticized. Add one more there "No 3rd party apps rocks!"

@iMav
Arey bhai, comma to maine bhi guess karke laga liya, but Windows supporters need to use WHAT to do WHAT? While Mac and Lin users haf it? Aisi kaun si cheez hai yaar?


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## superczar (Oct 19, 2007)

ohhhh man



> How will arya use a HD DVD on his Macbook, or goobi on his iMac?


 Don't just shoot from the hip....Kabhi toa dimag laga le bhai....How am I going to use HD DVD on my windows laptop either?

This isn't a Windows vs Mac thing, but a limitation of the limited upgradability of portable devices

When a HD DVD slim drive comes out, both Arya (on his Macbook) and I (on my windows laptop) should be able to upgrade .... (assuming I would want to)


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## gxsaurav (Oct 19, 2007)

superczar said:
			
		

> Don't just shoot from the hip....Kabhi toa dimag laga le bhai....How am I going to use HD DVD on my windows laptop either?


 
My mistake, that I bought a laptop in the discussion.

Edit: Thread going off topic


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