# Nehru Place among world's top 30 notorious IT markets: Report



## bibinjohn (Dec 14, 2012)

WASHINGTON: Indian capital's famous Nehru Place market has been placed among the top 30 notorious IT markets of the world that deal in goods and services infringing on intellectual property rights, an official US report has said.

"Nehru Place is reportedly one of the many markets in major cities throughout India that are known for dealing in large volumes of pirated software, pirated optical media containing movies and music, and counterfeit goods," said the report released by the US Trade Representatives (USTR).

Among other internet and physical markets that exemplify marketplaces that deal in infringing goods and services, facilitating and sustaining global piracy and counterfeiting include Urdu Bazaars in Karachi and Lahore.

However, China has the largest number of notorious markets listed in the report.

Prominent among them are Buynow PC Malls, which operates 22 stores across China and is known for selling computers with illegal operating system software and other unlawfully pre-installed software; Fu'an footwear and accessory market in Putian, Luohu Commercial Center in Shenzhen; Silk market in Beijing; and small commodities markets in Yiwu.

"Piracy and counterfeiting, including online sales of pirated and counterfeit goods, is a problem that hurts the US economy, harms some of this nation's most creative and innovative entrepreneurs and companies and threatens jobs for significant numbers of middle-class American workers," USTR Ron Kirk said.

"We highlight the notorious markets that have a negative impact on legitimate businesses and industries of all sizes that rely on intellectual property to protect their goods and services," he said.

Kirk also applaud the actions that some markets have taken to begin ridding their virtual and physical marketplaces of pirated and counterfeit goods, as well as enforcement actions taken by certain governments that have resulted in the shutdown of several other markets.

"It is through both voluntary and government actions that we will continue to improve the landscape for IPR owners and companies and their workers here at home that rely on IPR protection," he said.

USTR said Chinese site Taobao, has worked with rights holders to significantly decrease the listing of infringing products for sale through its website, and has committed to continue working to streamline its complaint procedures to further reduce listings of counterfeit products.

Similarly, Chinese website Sogou has been removed from the current list based on reports that it has also made notable efforts to work with rights holders to address the availability of infringing content on its site.

In addition, the Philippine Government has taken significant enforcement actions at the Quiapo Shopping District, which has reduced the number of counterfeit and pirated goods available for sale in this marketplace.

USTR has been identifying notorious markets since 2006.

Source : Times of India - Nehru Place among world's top 30 notorious IT markets: Report - The Times of India


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## Kirtu Jindal (Dec 14, 2012)

Well, I have been there a few times - and most of its "reputation" is well deserved. However, almost all IT centric markets in India - for example, the one in Secunderabad (near Hyderabad), or the one in Lalbagh in Lucknow - are all similar to Nehru Place - only difference is - Nehru Place is much, much bigger. So, the problem is much more visible there. Also, most IT companies have their "official" showrooms there too - the market is too important to simply ignore.


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## gameranand (Dec 14, 2012)

This doesn't surprise me at all.


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## NoasArcAngel (Dec 14, 2012)

bibinjohn said:


> WASHINGTON: Indian capital's famous Nehru Place market has been placed among the top 30 notorious IT markets of the world that deal in goods and services infringing on intellectual property rights, an official US report has said.
> 
> "Nehru Place is reportedly one of the many markets in major cities throughout India that are known for dealing in large volumes of pirated software, pirated optical media containing movies and music, and counterfeit goods," said the report released by the US Trade Representatives (USTR).
> 
> ...



i live in delhi, i buy pirated software. SO SUE ME!

till you make crap software and sell it for exorbitant prices ill pirate.


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## 101gamzer (Dec 14, 2012)

Good find.


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## sharang_3 (Dec 16, 2012)

NoasArcAngel said:


> i live in delhi, i buy pirated software. SO SUE ME!
> 
> till you make crap software and sell it for exorbitant prices ill pirate.


that is just a lame excuse ur making to justify pirating stuff..if the software is so crap why use it all..no one's asking you to use it anyway..n that's not just you its a problem with this entire country..we buy expensive hardware then believe that softwares somehow become our right and we can have them for free..ive seen friends who consider me an idiot for buying original games..i wish more people understood the concept of supporting developers..


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## NoasArcAngel (Dec 16, 2012)

sharang_3 said:


> that is just a lame excuse ur making to justify pirating stuff..if the software is so crap why use it all..no one's asking you to use it anyway..n that's not just you its a problem with this entire country..we buy expensive hardware then believe that softwares somehow become our right and we can have them for free..ive seen friends who consider me an idiot for buying original games..i wish more people understood the concept of supporting developers..



its crap, but i cant make do without it. And i dont consider anyone an idiot who pays for software its just depends upon your conscience i guess...? i wont feel bad pirating software... you may. Good for you. atleast when i run out of money i wont feel guilty about pirating.


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## CommanderShawnzer (Dec 16, 2012)

> that is just a lame excuse ur making to justify pirating stuff..if the software is so crap why use it all..no one's asking you to use it anyway..n that's not just you its a problem with this entire country..we buy expensive hardware then believe that softwares somehow become our right and we can have them for free..ive seen friends who consider me an idiot for buying original games..i wish more people understood the concept of supporting developers..


+10000000000000000000000000000


> its crap, but i cant make do without it. And i dont consider anyone an idiot who pays for software its just depends upon your conscience i guess...? i wont feel bad pirating software... you may. Good for you. atleast when i run out of money i wont feel guilty about pirating.


1.are the mods sleeping,or in cryo-stasis?
2.exorbitant prices  too expensive? dont buy or "get". simple
can't do without it?  e.g people pirate MS OFFICE and say there is "no alternative",even if they know about OpenOffice. One more Example : people pirate a Rs299 game and say its too "expensive" if the game sells for rs 50 they will want it for rs 20
so the point is
*YOU ARE A SHAMELESS THIEF*
Not like the other thiefs here who have atleast some amount of shame


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## NoasArcAngel (Dec 16, 2012)

CommanderShawnzer said:


> +10000000000000000000000000000
> 
> 1.are the mods sleeping,or in cryo-stasis?
> 2.exorbitant prices  too expensive? dont buy or "get". simple
> ...



thanks for the "SHAME" tag. i pirate software... SO as i SAID *SUE ME*

and no if you so called "white knights" ever pirate software, you will feel guilty. I am not ashamed of being a pirate. So suck it.

Call the mods, what are they going to do? Close the thread? I have never violated a single forum rule.

And I probably have much more legal media than many people here..i am not stingy and unlikeyour  Indian mentality if I feel it's worth it I pay for it..and not lash out at others because they pirate.


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## Faun (Dec 16, 2012)

^^you violated rules by proclaiming yourself as a proud pirate.

Just like any other job, software development is. They too are trying to feed their family.


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## NoasArcAngel (Dec 16, 2012)

As far as me office is concerned Microsoft is a billion dollar company hardly matters few bucks here and there


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## Krow (Dec 16, 2012)

NoasArcAngel said:


> Call the mods, what are they going to do? Close the thread? I have never violated a single forum rule.



Trolling or flame baiting in every other thread is against forum rules. Check your facts.


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## ico (Dec 16, 2012)

rip...


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## ssk_the_gr8 (Dec 16, 2012)

NoasArcAngel said:


> thanks for the "SHAME" tag. i pirate software... SO as i SAID *SUE ME*
> 
> 
> 
> Call the mods, what are they going to do? Close the thread? I have never violated a single forum rule.



This forum is anti piracy. By claiming that you're a proud pirate you are breaking the rules. Abide by the rules or post this sh!t someplace else.


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## TheLetterD (Dec 16, 2012)

If this wasnt India somebody wouldve probably sued him. Or if he had mentioned the software hes pirating the company wouldve probably sent threat-mails to him lol.

People think that they are stealing from Super Rich MultiNational Company CEOs, but you are not. The revenue loss affects the poor hardworking software developer's salary, not the CEOs, or the presidents etc.


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## CommanderShawnzer (Dec 16, 2012)

> unlike your Indian mentality if I feel it's worth it I pay for it


reported
look who's talking 
and if you feel its not "worth". it still lies in your computer and you still use the Software/game
basically all your dialogues are just paltry efforts at defending your vice
if you were in a country whose lawmakers are not illiterate fossils.a bunch of cyber security cops would've raided your home,seize your HDD and produce you in court


> *The revenue loss affects the poor hardworking software developer's salary, not the CEOs, or the presidents etc. *


+1,Those are the people that are HIT because of people like PirateGuy
and in india specifically the employees of the distributors recieve low salary


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## freshseasons (Dec 16, 2012)

NoasArcAngel said:


> i live in delhi, i buy pirated software. SO SUE ME!
> 
> till you make crap software and sell it for exorbitant prices ill pirate.



  Even an A Grade idiot would have iota of shame to agree that he is Pirating because he doesn't have money to use the wonderful software but he will risk his morality just so he could use the software.

   You have surpassed everything. If they make Crap software why even bother.There are tons of freewares out there. There's Linux.
   No ! You wouldn't use them . You need justification to rob and steal them of their hard work. 

  And that's a very bad statement to make (SO SUE ME) What you should have written was SO HOLD ME GUILTY OR CHARGE ME. Sueing is done when you defame the concerned party which of course we are not.

  But then i guess wrong choice of morality may sometimes take toll on Bad Choice of Words.


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## sumonpathak (Dec 16, 2012)

> I probably have much more legal media than many people here


errr...............


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## vipul619 (Dec 17, 2012)

People usually pirate because they can't afford it.
Then it becomes a habit.
They love their pirated collections as well, and among friends, find it awesome to tell that they can get anything at all for free (obviously soft copy, no hardwares ).

But no reasons can justify that pirating isn't stealing!
They know it, and they accept it.
But tagging yourself as a proud pirate publicly on a forum that is against piracy is just unacceptable!


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## Vyom (Dec 17, 2012)

Ignoring the shameless claims to pirate by NoasArcDevil, I would like to say a few things about Nehru Place where I went a couple of times in last month.

*1. Its hard to find stuff:*
	I am surprized to find out that even in the most famous IT markets in our country, I can't find some hardware like a Seasonic or Antec PSUs.

*2. Calls of "Software Lelo" still exists:*
	I used to witness guys screaming "Software lelo" all over NP around 2007. Yentivirus, Bindows, Fotoshop, just name it, and you shall get it. And it seems conditions have only gotten worse in last few years. Now they also say, "Check karwa ke denge!".
	Being a software engg, watching such disrespect for Softwares pisses me off.

*3. Unhygeinic environment:*
	The hygeine still sucks. From pan spits to garbage, it doesn't pleases the eye. With a market so renowed, I expected a bit better. But I guess I am just asking of too much.

4. Plus, I got my mobo E250N, Rs. 200 cheaper on FK. So much so for the biggest IT market! 

Granted I got many components like a Dell IN2030 and APC 600 VA UPS on good price, but that was only because there was no major festival around, where they could hike up the price.


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## avinandan012 (Dec 17, 2012)

C'mon apart from some Microsoft & Adobe products all are subsidized keeping the Indian buyer in mind. An AAA title costing $59.99 can't be converted to Rs. 999, it's the cheap mentality of people.

And look at songs market, most online retailers providing high quality FLAC/mp3 s for Rs.5/6 & still people are keen on piracy


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## ratul (Dec 17, 2012)

Vyom said:


> Ignoring the shameless claims to pirate by NoasArcDevil, I would like to say a few things about Nehru Place where I went a couple of times in last month.
> 
> *1. Its hard to find stuff:*
> I am surprized to find out that even in the most famous IT markets in our country, I can't find some hardware like a Seasonic or Antec PSUs.
> ...



can't agree more with this guy.. 
i too was searching for razer naga, and was not able to find it on 95% of shops, the one that had stocks was one of my favorites "SMC International".
Also, there had been times since last 5 yrs, where i have to search almost whole market to find what i want in just 1-2shops..
Earlier in 2008-09, rates used to be pretty cheap there compared to other markets, but now i can find the same thing cheaper in Laxmi Nagar Computer market near my home than in nehru place, the proclaimed biggest IT market in Asia.. 
Recently i think last year, police conducted a special drive there to remove those "S/w lelo" guys from there, and from then i see a decrease in number of those guys, but still their remains are visible, proudly shouting " Bindows 8 50rs.".. 
I don't know what to say, but in past 5 years, either Nehru place's repo has taken a deep plunge, or other markets have risen theirs..


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## d6bmg (Dec 17, 2012)

That's why it's India.


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## amjath (Dec 17, 2012)

In order to eliminate pirates copy to windows, MS has a launched a promo offer for Windows 8 and that too u can upgrade Win 8 even though u have pirated win 7. What else u expect them to do.


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## sumonpathak (Dec 17, 2012)

they should subsidize the win7


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## bippukt (Dec 17, 2012)

avinandan012 said:


> C'mon apart from some Microsoft & Adobe products all are subsidized keeping the Indian buyer in mind. An AAA title costing $59.99 can't be converted to Rs. 999, it's the cheap mentality of people.
> 
> And look at songs market, most online retailers providing high quality FLAC/mp3 s for Rs.5/6 & still people are keen on pirate



I totally agree with you on the music part. Songs are being offered so cheap, yet people do not buy them. Of course, if you a decent internet connection, you can just use Youtube. Its legal and still free 

However, I do not agree with your argument on the Games front. Maybe you have enough money to pay Rs 1499 for a game, but I don't. The 999 price worked great for me, but I will absolutely not buy a game priced at 1499. That us just too expensive for most of us in India, whether you agree or not. I don't know what EA are thinking, but I will not buy their games unless their price drops close to 999. I bought BF3 Premium Edition when it was offered for 900. Of course, with Steam and other Digital Download services, the incentive to buy games is great. $5 for Batman or Deus Ex Human Revolution or Mass Effect? Yes please!

What really irritates me is people spending 600-700 on a 2 hour movie (2 tickets plus cold drink/popcorn) plus transportation costs, but ask them to spend 800-900 for Max Payne or Assassin's Creed III, and they look at you as if you are stupid!


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## avinandan012 (Dec 17, 2012)

if proper Broad Band is introduced in India with good QoS + Steam Sales = less piracy

EA should consider their pricing around Rs.999


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## DDIF (Dec 17, 2012)

avinandan012 said:


> if proper Broad Band is introduced in India with good QoS + Steam Sales = less piracy
> 
> EA should consider their pricing around Rs.999



Things depend on different factors. You made a good point, what can you do if you can get cheap digital copies of softwares but you have to wait for 30 hours to download at current speed.
So many things need to be changed and improved. Ever since I started using Nextworld.in and Flipkart, I haven't used any pirated game or software. Either free or paid, no piracy.
Still I can't buy some softwares as I won't be able to download them with my current speed.


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## doomgiver (Dec 17, 2012)

bippukt said:


> I totally agree with you on the music part. Songs are being offered so cheap, yet people do not buy them. Of course, if you a decent internet connection, you can just use Youtube. Its legal and still free
> 
> However, I do not agree with your argument on the Games front. Maybe you have enough money to pay Rs 1499 for a game, but I don't. The 999 price worked great for me, but I will absolutely not buy a game priced at 1499. That us just too expensive for most of us in India, whether you agree or not. I don't know what EA are thinking, but I will not buy their games unless their price drops close to 999. I bought BF3 Premium Edition when it was offered for 900. Of course, with Steam and other Digital Download services, the incentive to buy games is great. $5 for Batman or Deus Ex Human Revolution or Mass Effect? Yes please!
> 
> What really irritates me is people spending 600-700 on a 2 hour movie (2 tickets plus cold drink/popcorn) plus transportation costs, but ask them to spend 800-900 for Max Payne or Assassin's Creed III, and they look at you as if you are stupid!


good point.
these people should realize that this is not the USA where people pay $5 for a cup of coffee without thinking or $10 for a bottle of coke.

$60 = 3000 rupees (AAA titles)

hell, people are not willing to pay that much for graphics cards. they certainly wont pay that much for a game.

Noah'sArcAngel made a VERY good point.
make good games, or die.

i actually paid for homefront game, and finished it in 4 hours.
i was so mad i threw the disc and stamped on it (thankfully it was just scratched in places, and i managed to gift it off)

not bought a single game since then, except the humble bundles


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## theserpent (Dec 17, 2012)

vipul619 said:


> People usually pirate because they can't afford it.
> Then it becomes a habit.
> They l*ove their pirated collections as well, and among friends, find it awesome to tell that they can get anything at all for free* (obviously soft copy, no hardwares ).
> 
> ...



+1.Now my friends when they ask my Game cds I can't give them, Its so hard to explain  them DRM,CD-Key protected they can't understand all this.
Some even told me to pass me my full social id

Now see, around 60% don't understand Benfits of original, if they wait for steam sales,budles they can  get the best deal ever
I got around 6-7 games for 300 BUCKS*(THQ BUNDLE)*


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## ridikulus (Dec 17, 2012)

After reading most of the comments, i have something to share....... people dont realize that when they say that piracy hurts the software developers the statement is wrong.

Most of the commercially available software is published by billion dollar MNC's. For a software product retailing for 500$ say, they give 1% of the total 5 dollars per copy to the WHOLE DEV team. 

so the MNC's are the ones who are keeping the majority of the profit and filling their coffers......

I think we need to keep the statement about how software piracy hurts devs out of our minds and think straight and clear for a moment.... most of the software made commercial.... where is it sold? ex if microsoft releases windows where is the maximum number of copies sold? in which country? 


someone talked about software subsidy... let me ask you something... we are living in India... its a 3rd world country you cant compare the buying power with any developed nation like the USA. Computer components are already expensive here yet the software publishers expect us to buy original software for our machines....

i mean isnt it enough? shelling out 60k for a pc then another 10k for software? And why the compulsion? Why is a pirate branded a thief ? Tell me one company which gives the DEVS the fair share of profit.... 


The industry does not realize this and then they want to make profits from us...? And if they are so concerned about software piracy why is software export not allowed in certain countries? even if these countries have anti-american sentiments doesnt mean people dont have right to use the pc over there? 

its time to stop being so naive....

Maybe its time you took a different stand towards piracy.... just because people say something doesnt mean you need to be guided by them. i dont support piracy but i dont think that people who are pirates also have a choice. No one wants to be the bad guy, but you have to understand what can be done and what cant...

Yes i dont think that each and every software should be pirated, but there are somethings which you have to do and some things you dont. If piracy wasnt so rampant in ASIA i guess we would still end up paying 10,000 rs for a original copy of windows.

SO dont BRAND A PIRATE A THIEF, just keep in mind you are also BENEFITING FROM THIS ACT. and so the guilt lies on you, for blaming the people who made your lives easier, so software products dont burn a hole in your pocket.

a


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## theserpent (Dec 17, 2012)

We all are going way offtopic
Anyways @rid, Your kinda wrong, AFAIK there are few companies that are almost bankrupt due to piracy,some have even closed up Correct me if i am wrong


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## ridikulus (Dec 17, 2012)

you have to agree, piracy has made software cheaper.


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## pranav0091 (Dec 17, 2012)

What makes more sense for developers -High price per copy and high piracy or lower income per copy but hopefully slightly less piracy?

Some of these softwares/games are priced just waaay too high for many to buy them. Though I wouldn't justify piracy, it isnt far from the truth that atleast part of the reason why people pirate is price. It becomes very easy for them to think "XYZ makes millions and I hardly a few hundred every month, whats the big deal if I get one copy for free?"

Game publishers, see how the Humble bundle performed and take note. I mean a game that costs half as much as the graphics card thats needed to play it doesnt sound like a convincing argument to buy.


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## ridikulus (Dec 17, 2012)

this google search results makes a good read.

*programmers.stackexchange.com/ques...es-that-have-gone-out-of-business-due-to-pira

@offtopic whats with the random question ?


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## ridikulus (Dec 17, 2012)

i just read this : 

" 

Why You Should Not Use Pirated Software
It is a crime. Laws are made to be enforced but many people take comfort in the fact that the police can’t arrest everyone (which the police would almost have to do when it comes to users, based on statistics). However – many, many people pay fines when they’re caught speeding so in the future it could become the norm. Even if you can get away with it, you should still be bothered by the fear you would feel when the police came knocking at your office or home.
Pirated software often contains viruses or malware that could e.g. turn your computer into part of a botnet, and thus usable remotely by hackers for other nefarious purposes, possibly even for organized crime.
Software companies are all impacted but the little guy is hit hardest – it’s not just faceless mega-corporations as many people justify to themselves; although as I point out above, they are the most capable of surviving to fight piracy with their deep pockets. The small and medium-size companies are a different story – with possibly only one software product to sell in limited distribution, they will usually need to charge a high price for their specialized software in order to recoup their investment. Illegal copies would cut off their only source of limited revenue and possibly force them to go bankrupt, as almost happened to Montreal-based SoftImage before it was purchased by Microsoft in the ’90s. Ironically, Microsoft then went on to pirate someone else’s software in an attempt to add value to the SoftImage product.
Criminals use pirated software to finance their activities e.g. Palestinian terrorists use it to finance their attacks on Israelis. Better think twice before buying some cheap CD on the 6th floor of the Central Bus Station in Tel Aviv.

"
taken from 

Read more at: Is Software Piracy Really Theft? | JobMob

it is less than half the truth, and because of such arguments people think piracy is bad, no doubt it is bad but bad is also blaming piracy for all the spam / virus / terrorist attacks in the world.


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## ridikulus (Dec 17, 2012)

CommanderShawnzer said:


> +10000000000000000000000000000
> 
> 1.are the mods sleeping,or in cryo-stasis?
> 2.exorbitant prices  too expensive? dont buy or "get". simple
> ...



if tomorrow someone falls ill in your family, and you have no money for medicine are you going to let them die? or if the medicine is to expensive you are going to let them die?


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## Vyom (Dec 17, 2012)

@ridikulus:
Being a pirate is one problem. Admitting it is another. But shouting, "Sue Me, since I am a pirate", is totally different case. This offtopic discussion began when someone indulged in the third case. Which totally isn't acceptable no matter whatever the argument.


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## sharang_3 (Dec 17, 2012)

at the end of the day if you cant afford it don't buy it but stop blaming developers for pricing games high..current games have 40-50million dollars as their budgets and hardly a few make profit..If piracy doesn't do anything why do we so many games going PS3 or Xbox exclusive? Ill give an example here..Suppose you can't afford a Mercedes so can't just steal it cz the company is rich anyways..And if people think pirating isn't equal to stealing that is being stupid..imagine i make a clone of that merc and drive it away..that makes the original merc unsold hence all the efforts and money used in r&d goes to waste. Please note that when one sells a game for $60 that isnt just the disc and the case, it includes the cost of all the development expenditure as well


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## ridikulus (Dec 17, 2012)

sharang_3 said:


> at the end of the day if you cant afford it don't buy it but stop blaming developers for pricing games high..current games have 40-50million dollars as their budgets and hardly a few make profit..If piracy doesn't do anything why do we so many games going PS3 or Xbox exclusive? Ill give an example here..Suppose you can't afford a Mercedes so can't just steal it cz the company is rich anyways..And if people think pirating isn't equal to stealing that is being stupid..imagine i make a clone of that merc and drive it away..that makes the original merc unsold hence all the efforts and money used in r&d goes to waste. Please note that when one sells a game for $60 that isnt just the disc and the case, it includes the cost of all the development expenditure as well



you talk about profits, game budgets may be 40-50 million dollars, but just look at the number they sell..... what you are saying is wrong, pc exclusives cant be made because of hardware limitations and dont put piracy in between it has nothing do to with piracy. Same case with Ios and Android, a 4s may play a game butter smooth that the lg nexus 4 cant.

pirating is not stealing, its the people who publish the software steal from both - money from people like you and me (consumers) and devs ( skills and resources ).

yeah, when you start manufacturing units in millions a game which sells for 60$, disc cost and case work out < 8$ ....


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## bippukt (Dec 17, 2012)

sharang_3 said:


> at the end of the day if you cant afford it don't buy it but stop blaming developers for pricing games high..current games have 40-50million dollars as their budgets and hardly a few make profit..If piracy doesn't do anything why do we so many games going PS3 or Xbox exclusive? Ill give an example here..Suppose you can't afford a Mercedes so can't just steal it cz the company is rich anyways..And if people think pirating isn't equal to stealing that is being stupid..imagine i make a clone of that merc and drive it away..that makes the original merc unsold hence all the efforts and money used in r&d goes to waste. Please note that when one sells a game for $60 that isnt just the disc and the case, it includes the cost of all the development expenditure as well



Let's step away from the discussion of piracy.

Pricing games at 3000-3500 ($50-60)in India means that you have restricted your potential market to a very tiny fraction of well to do people. Do you honestly believe that an ordinary middle-class person earning 30k a month can afford a game priced at 3k? Do you honestly believe that if the same game were available for 1k, it wouldn't drastically increase his capacity to buy it? If companies price software and games without taking into account the living standard of a country, then they are going to fail.

The only reason I didn't buy an XBOX 360 or a PS3 and stuck with my PC was that the console games were priced extremely high. PC games for 1k each, however, I could buy several a month.


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## ridikulus (Dec 17, 2012)

sharang_3 said:


> at the end of the day if you cant afford it don't buy it but stop blaming developers for pricing games high..current games have 40-50million dollars as their budgets and hardly a few make profit..If piracy doesn't do anything why do we so many games going PS3 or Xbox exclusive? Ill give an example here..Suppose you can't afford a Mercedes so can't just steal it cz the company is rich anyways..And if people think pirating isn't equal to stealing that is being stupid..imagine i make a clone of that merc and drive it away..that makes the original merc unsold hence all the efforts and money used in r&d goes to waste. Please note that when one sells a game for $60 that isnt just the disc and the case, it includes the cost of all the development expenditure as well



and anyways case of cars and computers is totally different, someone once said that if " If the automobile had followed the same development cycle as the computer, a Rolls-Royce would today cost $100, get a million miles per gallon, and explode once a year, killing everyone inside. "


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## ridikulus (Dec 17, 2012)

sharang_3 said:


> at the end of the day if you cant afford it don't buy it but stop blaming developers for pricing games high..current games have 40-50million dollars as their budgets and hardly a few make profit..If piracy doesn't do anything why do we so many games going PS3 or Xbox exclusive? Ill give an example here..Suppose you can't afford a Mercedes so can't just steal it cz the company is rich anyways..And if people think pirating isn't equal to stealing that is being stupid..imagine i make a clone of that merc and drive it away..that makes the original merc unsold hence all the efforts and money used in r&d goes to waste. Please note that when one sells a game for $60 that isnt just the disc and the case, it includes the cost of all the development expenditure as well



according to the logic you are giving soon software which serves the same purpose as a software which you have to buy will also be considered piracy? its like i buy windows use it as a os, then i get linux that i use as an os.... so i am helping reduce sales of microsoft windows by using a FREE OS, so that is piracy now...

now i really understand why this country is going to the dogs.


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## pranav0091 (Dec 17, 2012)

sharang_3 said:


> .current games have 40-50million dollars as their budgets and hardly a few make profit..



Correct me if I'm wrong, but I disagree. If all the people who pirate stop using the game altogether, the developer is not going to make one penny more than he is doing already. And in such a scenario, pricing the games even higher and thereby indirectly feeding piracy is not the most brilliant of ideas. But what if the developer prices it lower, according to the markets? I have reason to believe that the sales will increase. It may not be enough to offset the reduction in price, but there has to be a sweet spot somewhere in the middle. Like it or not, these people who used pirated software, most of the times, do it because of the price.

Friends of mine who used to use pirated copies of antivirus, have now started buying them. Because they are comparatively cheap and easily available. Of course there are always some who will never buy stuff if they can get it for free, but the point I wish to make is that pricing the copies high is not the smartest thing to do in a market where the penetration of piracy is as high as India.


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## ridikulus (Dec 17, 2012)

if software companies are so worried about piracy why not put in stricter regimes.. like DRM? why are they afraid? its because they will lose their base



Vyom said:


> @ridikulus:
> Being a pirate is one problem. Admitting it is another. But shouting, "Sue Me, since I am a pirate", is totally different case. This offtopic discussion began when someone indulged in the third case. Which totally isn't acceptable no matter whatever the argument.



what i dont understand is that how he or she is doing anything wrong...? are you moral police? everyone has the right to voice their opinion even if against the law or rules in this case i guess.... ?

and how is it damaging you?? ..... talk about making mountains out of mole hills.



CommanderShawnzer said:


> reported
> look who's talking
> and if you feel its not "worth". it still lies in your computer and you still use the Software/game
> basically all your dialogues are just paltry efforts at defending your vice
> ...



yes thats why in the USA which i think has pretty strict law, people get arrested for downloading winrar? sheesh man..... how many people have been arrested for software piracy till date?

why dont software companies use formats like steam, unless you connect to the internet you cannot use the software...? there is so much software companies can do to prevent piracy... but no.... so if they dont care then why will the people? and lets face it no one is strict about anti-piracy... its a joke.

Since everyone on this forum is babbling about how piracy is bad .. i want to ask all of you 1 question. 


If we lived in a world, where there was no software piracy... would you pay the exact retail amount for the software which is sold in a developed country?


I hope you answer this question honestly.


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## TheLetterD (Dec 17, 2012)

People want to buy Jaguars and Lamborghini but aren't ready to pay for petrol.
Yes, Windows and some of the professional grade software isn't subsidized in India, but Games are. I am really happy that I can get (Not so)old PC classics for so cheap (Crysis 1, Far Cry 2, GTA 4 etc for 250-400!) on sites like Flipkart. Otherwise the only place you found original games were in Music World and Planet Ms and Malls etc at full MRP!! No matter how old they were!
ANDDDDDDD I just went to the UK a few months back! There are big retail stores where you can buy used (TESTED) original Games at less than 1/2 the price! Even for PS3 and XBOX! I bought Crysis 2 for my uncle @12 Pounds(Roughly 1000 bucks)! FOR THE PS3! It was used, yes, but still almost scratch less! The thing is when hardcore gamers buy the game as soon as it launches and finish it overnight/in less than a week, they sell the game and get their moneys worth!  How awesome is that, and you could get movies too! But no, you couldn't get Software! 
But there are so many alternatives to those professional grade softwares! Yes they wont have the latest hitech flashy features, but then again youre not paying a dime for them are you? 
And I think we are stretching this conversation a bit. People who are at-least ashamed about pirating software can be convinced to switch to original+free software. Not shameless ones who announce it like they deserve a Bravery medal for it. Sorry I know targeting a person is not allowed on this forum, so please DM me if you feel I should change/remove this part. Dont BAN me. LOL


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## sumonpathak (Dec 17, 2012)

ridikulus said:


> If we lived in a world, where there was no software piracy... would you pay the exact retail amount for the software which is sold in a developed country?
> I hope you answer this question honestly.



yes..since we pay the the same damn amount for a GAME...or for anything..any commodities..and as letterD suggested..we have the taste for Ferrari..but want subsidized petrol to run it....Grow up guys..if ya pirate(for whatever reason) dont try to claim a bravery award for it...if ya dont...thats good...
i could go on and on for this...but wouldn't add much to the discussion..


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## whitestar_999 (Dec 17, 2012)

@ridikulus,stop spreading your flawed sense of morality here.software/game/os is not your basic human right & you won't die because of lack of it unlike food,water & medical care.so what if games are overpriced,microsoft is profiting,blah,blah,blah..........in the end it all comes down to this:either you pay or you steal whatever the reason but in this case you can not justify your stealing by saying that if i hadn't stole it i would be dead.

@the letterD,don't worry about saying the correct thing.as you can see even mods agree with you(edited the tag to a rightly deserved one for the member who started this  )


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## vipul619 (Dec 18, 2012)

I like trains!
End of OT.. XD

I'm surprised there's no mention of Palika Bazaar


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## dr.rdb (Dec 18, 2012)

My point is when I am getting free of cost, why should I pay for them ? 

Oh the dear poor devs !


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## ssk_the_gr8 (Dec 19, 2012)

dr.rdb said:


> My point is when I am getting free of cost, why should I pay for them ?
> 
> Oh the dear poor devs !



they have to feed their families too. I guess you're not a developer. I wonder how happy would you be to work for free.


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## sumonpathak (Dec 19, 2012)

i think Herr doc should work for free for a few months


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## avinandan012 (Dec 19, 2012)

^ well some good docs works for free for those social camps held but the numbers are poor.

One good sign against piracy : i recently visited CTC market for a friend's laptop purchase & roamed for about 4hrs there and most of the retailers are insisting on buying Original Windows 8 for PC/Laptops

About dev companies they should do some market review in big cities& some small towns about the income of middle class consumers. That should make them understand that how hard it is for a person earning about $400/month, to purchase a $60 or $150 software.


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## Kirtu Jindal (Dec 19, 2012)

Two side to the argument - and both have valid points.

The people - the users in India - need affordable (even if not cheap) software solutions - the software companies ought to have realized that by now. 

The developers and software companies - need to make money stay afloat and develop still new stuff.

A balance has to be found somewhere. That being said, the availability of affordable software will not entirely kill piracy - it never will.


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## avinandan012 (Dec 19, 2012)

have a look at this thread & all links

To dev companies i can give them a good & efficient way to reduce their cost OPEN DEV CENTERS IN INDIA. 
1. Land is free(cause most states are trying to grab a bite the profit of Software Industry), state govts are giving leases in practically cheap tend to free price
2. Vast office space can be build / bought for the same amount money they had to put up to setup an office for 50 people in US
3. Cheap quality brain power available 
example :
for $500/*month* they can have a resource, same resource if they hire in US will cost them at least $40/*hour*


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## bippukt (Dec 22, 2012)

This is an interesting article. Is your experience the same as that of this blogger?

In defence of Nehru Place by WebWise : Javed Anwer's blog-The Times Of India


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## The Sorcerer (Dec 22, 2012)

I hope the proud pirate knows that criminals and organized crime use sales and distribution of pirated softwares and movies to earn money for their activities. You're basically funding for such people. If you're proud of that...well....

Some guy over here used the words "Oh the poor devs" I say "Oh the poor you! You don't get how it works, do you?". 

If you don't like it, don't use it. If you can't afford it- unless you cannot find a free/cheaper option why use it?

Then again, piracy/downloading "stuff" is something many have done one day or the other. Its nothing to be proud of- but people do it for many reasons. Some say its expensive- (well- how many expensive softwares that are used by standard users? For specifically for work and all, people earn money out of it so its fair to pay for a genuine update)- some say its awfully convenient. Some say because of stuff like too much DRMs that affects their gameplay and stuff. Some also do it because you don't get those movies over here- either the quality that you get from movie disc publishers are not good or some lame censorship is done (their words, not mine), so they go the piracy download way.

Heck- companies do it too!!! You'll be surprised, major publications that run PC Hardware review magazines/websites in India use pirated/cracked benchmarking software too. I know . Many external storage drives landed in my place with those cracks- atleast couple of them had a sality virus too!! 

Unless it affects that person as a software/game maker, people will have many ways to justify their "pride" by embracing piracy. On the bright side if you see people who now buy original software/ games have increased. So...


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## CommanderShawnzer (Dec 22, 2012)

^
+10000000000000000
Why did'nt THIS guy post here in this forum earlier



> if tomorrow someone falls ill in your family, and you have no money for medicine are you going to let them die? or if the medicine is to expensive you are going to let them die?


you little p***k
you are comparing BASIC Necessities like medicine,food etc to luxury items like games/movies/software? i pity you
if i/my family dont get games/movies/software we won't die
maybe you will  



> so please DM me if you feel I should change/remove this part. Dont BAN me. LOL


hey mods are unpredictable,i got banned ,for 2 days for posting something "offensive" here i think against Mr.sue me im a pirate
worst thing i did'nt know that i was banned



> This is an interesting article. Is your experience the same as that of this blogger?


the blogger is *cough* CHIP's *cough* india editor


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