# which 64bitLinux



## savithk (Oct 24, 2006)

I have AMD64 2800+, 512 RAM, 256 8X AGP, 80GB . i want to use linux for Maya & Softimage XSI. so please tell me which 64bitLinux free version is available ??????


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## [xubz] (Oct 24, 2006)

I Suggest you get Fedora Core.. (FC6 was Released Today).

*fedoraproject.org/wiki/


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## Desi-Tek.com (Oct 24, 2006)

fedora rocks


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## techbirbal (Oct 24, 2006)

I am using Mandriva 2007 64bit.

It has great support for AIGLX, and the 3D effects are cool.

If you need the CD , PM me .

Enjoy.
BirBal.
www.techbirbal.com


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## [xubz] (Oct 24, 2006)

AIGLX was Jointed Developed by NVIDIA and Red Hat.. so Obviously Fedora has the Leading Edge here..

AIGLX is ALSO Supported on Ubuntu 6.10, with the Latest NVIDIA Beta Drivers.


(I Only reason I Love Ubuntu is cuz of its Community and APT)


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## techbirbal (Oct 24, 2006)

Dont Forget Xgl too on mandrake.

You also have the latest Cedega software to play Windows Games in Linux. 

Enjoy!!


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## mehulved (Oct 24, 2006)

Well all the distros can have all that. So stating one has it is totally absurd.
But, it is not advisable to use a 64 bit distro as of now due to lack of availability of 64 bit softwares. No. of 64 bit software at present are lower than 32 bit ones. We will have to wait some more time before focus shifts completely to 64 bit.


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## savithk (Oct 24, 2006)

Mandriva 2007 64bit is free ?????
__________
i want to install only free version of linux64 bit


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## techbirbal (Oct 24, 2006)

yup mandriva 2007 is free.

Its a 4 CD pack for 64 bit edition


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## gary4gar (Oct 24, 2006)

if u want 64 bit linux then u have to install 32 bit one in it as still there is no flash,java & many app


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## JGuru (Oct 24, 2006)

You can download *Mandriva 2007 Linux* (64-bit or 32-bit) from here
 I doubt whether you can run 32-bit applications like Java, Flash & other 32-bit applications.
 So installing a 32-bit version of Mandriva 2007 Linux is a better & sound choice.
  Don't worry you can install a 32-bit Linux in your 64-bit AMD PC. 
  There won't be any problem. But you won't get the 64-bit PC performance.


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## rakeshishere (Oct 24, 2006)

Better use 32 bit ubuntu v6.10 	going to be released on 26 October 2006


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## Rollercoaster (Oct 24, 2006)

it is a pain to get all ur hardware working on 64 bit


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## praka123 (Oct 24, 2006)

well i found this gentoo forum thread useful for all amd-64 users and aspirants
*forums.gentoo.org/viewtopic-t-221361.html


> * mplayer / xine  dont play some movies , *.wmv/*.rm/win32codecs dont work *
> A: You need 32bit mplayer to use 32bit codecs (for stuff like wmv9 and real). No win64codecs are currently availible.
> Take a look at this guide and this topics: xine thread or  this mplayer thread or just search for "mplayer" in amd64 forum what will answer your questions on this topic more completely. 32bit realpayer also works on amd64 if you want to play *.rm files.
> See here what gentoo-wiki has to say about it.


below wiki article also may hold great use:
*gentoo-wiki.com/HOWTO_AMD_64


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## gary4gar (Oct 24, 2006)

^^^
*so net result is*
if your are new to linux, 64bit is a abosulute no-no but if are a g33k then u can try ur hand


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## john_the_ultimate (Oct 25, 2006)

I've got ubuntu 6.06 AMD 64-bit version and works flawlessly. Even recognised my dual core X2 3800+ CPU.


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## eddie (Oct 25, 2006)

There is a thumb rule while planning to use a 64bit Linux depending on the amount of RAM you have. It goes like this...
< 1 GB RAM = 32 bit user land - 32 bit kernel
= 1 GB RAM = 32 bit user land - 64 bit kernel
> 1 GB RAM = 64 bit user land - 64 bit kernel

Since you just have 512 MB RAM, imho you should stay with 32 bit Linux distros. Rest is upto you...

[EDIT}I have changed user space to user land so that it is clearer[/EDIT]


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## kalpik (Oct 25, 2006)

eddie, can you explain the logic behind it? And what do you mean when you say user space?


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## mediator (Oct 25, 2006)

eddie said:
			
		

> There is a thumb rule while planning to use a 64bit Linux depending on the amount of RAM you have. It goes like this...
> < 1 GB RAM = 32 bit user space - 32 bit kernel
> = 1 GB RAM = 32 bit user space - 64 bit kernel
> > 1 GB RAM = 64 bit user space - 64 bit kernel
> ...



No eddie, >1GB ram doesn't necessarily means 64 bit system. There's no thumb rule in my knowledge, but all it has a little scientific explanation!

See 32 bit means 2^32 (2 raised to power 32) = 4,294,967,296 bytes   and that's 4 GB.
SO u see a 32 bit system has a maximum supported RAM size of 4 GB.

Similarly 64 bit system has a max. supported RAM size of 2^64 = 18446744,073,709,551,616.  I dunno how many billion terrabytes are these. I guess they call it *16 exabytes*. Nice na?

Neways I dunno why u have written user space ad kernel space differently, both are just classifications of virtual memory .

@kalpiks : Users space is the user memory, where user apps can work and where swapping takes place.


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## savithk (Oct 25, 2006)

if i install linux64 on my AMD64 2800+ is support ???. i have only 512 MB of Ram it is ok for linux64 . or should i go for 1GB of RAM ????. any linux64 is available on single CD.????


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## Rollercoaster (Oct 25, 2006)

yes it will work fine.. dont depend on the seemingly hightech talk goin on

i assure u no one actually knows anything


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## kalpik (Oct 25, 2006)

mediator said:
			
		

> @kalpik : Users space is the user memory, where user apps can work and where swapping takes place.


Exactly.. Even i thot that.. That's why i was confused when he mentioned them separately..


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## eddie (Oct 25, 2006)

mediator said:
			
		

> No eddie, >1GB ram doesn't necessarily means 64 bit system. There's no thumb rule in my knowledge, but all it has a little scientific explanation!
> 
> See 32 bit means 2^32 (2 raised to power 32) = 4,294,967,296 bytes   and that's 4 GB.
> SO u see a 32 bit system has a maximum supported RAM size of 4 GB.
> ...


 Mediator the explanation given by you is theoretical but practically Linux kernel has a problem which was first identified in 2001. 32bit Linux Kernel splits the 4GB memory in two parts of 1GB and 3GB. Now kernel needs to map virtual space for every process to physically available memory but at any given point *unpatched* Linux kernel can map only 1GB of kernel virtual space to the physical memory. Further, out of this 1GB Memory, 128MB is reserved for storing memory mapping and paging table structures which is done only when kernel has to handle huge amounts of physical memory (>=1GB). This in turn means that Linux kernel can  *effectively* access only 1GB - 128MB = 896MB of physical memory at any given time.

To solve this problem, two things were put under development. One of them was community driven 2GB/2GB and 3GB/1GB mem split patches. This was done to increase the amount of memory accessible by kernel space to 2GB and 3GB respectively. This approach was not widely accepted because it was more of a hack put together by a few developers so another set of patches was developed by kernel devs. This is known as HIGHMEM support and comes in two forms i.e. 4GB and 64GB memory support. 64GB HIGHMEM support was developed for processors like PentiumPro that were released with special instructions to address 4GB Memory limitation and increased it to 64GB.

This HIGHMEM support sounds interesting but it has its own share of problems. It is still not well tested and breaks drivers on random. Also, I/O devices cannot access HIGHMEM support directly and rather need to go through specific processes in kernel space. This leads to unnecessary overhead in kernel space and if possible, it should be avoided. Thus, moving on to 64bit kernel is advised.

Now coming to the thumb rule.

1) Anything below 896MB of Physical memory can be accessed directly by 32bit kernel. Also 64bit binaries are larger in size and they will take more space in RAM thus hogging your memory. This will nullify the performance boost your are supposed to get because you simply don't have enough RAM hence 32bit kernel and 32bit applications are recommended.
2) Next, we move to the limit of 896MB - 1GB. Here you need to make a choice. If you are very picky and do not want to waste even the 128MB of RAM then 64bit kernel and 32bit applications are recommended. The idea is NOT to enable HIGHMEM support just to access that 128MB of RAM because it increases kernel overload without much benefit but use the full amount of RAM at your disposal. 32bit applications are recommended for the same reason that is given above.
3) After this we come to >1GB Physical memory. Now here you have a choice of using HIGHMEM support (or) using just 64bit kernel (or) moving completely to 64bit system. Here, it totally depends on you and your choice but going to a full 64bit system is recommended because:
a) It avoids using HIGHMEM which is still not well tested.
b) 64bit kernel will address memory limitations and provide you a little extra performance boost.
b) 64bit binaries are known to be larger then 32bit binaries in Linux environment but the extra physical memory at your disposal allows you to gain that little extra by optimizing them for 64bit and not care about memory hogging.

Hence the thumb rule...


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## mediator (Oct 25, 2006)

Hmmm......I didn't know something like that existed practically! Neways I'll be pleased if u enlighten me on following questions. 

1. If the bug was founded in 2001, then whats the present status?

2. 


			
				eddie said:
			
		

> support. *64GB HIGHMEM* support was developed for processors like PentiumPro that were released with special instructions to address *4GB Memory limitation and increased it to 64GB*.


Is it 64 bit HIGHMEM that u mistakenly typed as 64 GB?? IF not so, then how 4GB was increased to 64 GB? I didnt get this one!

Neways I hope the thumb rule will be eliminated in future 32 bit Linuxes and I wonder if they are having trouble with 32 bit, then how'll they manage 64 bit and how'll they partition the exabytes!!


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## eddie (Oct 25, 2006)

mediator said:
			
		

> Hmmm......I didn't know something like that existed practically! Neways I'll be pleased if u enlighten me on following questions.
> 
> 1. If the bug was founded in 2001, then whats the present status?


It is not a bug but a limitation that has been addressed using patches. The current status is that both HIGHMEM 4GB and 64GB patches are present in official kernel. You can enable it if you have more than 1GB RAM but with earlier said kernel overload.


> 2. Is it 64 bit HIGHMEM that u mistakenly typed as 64 GB?? IF not so, then how 4GB was increased to 64 GB? I didnt get this one!


The answer lies in PentiumPro architecture and the PEA extension that it came with. These processors supported 36bit which translated into 64GB of physical memory support. Thus the kernel was made to support full memory range which could be supported by the processor but as the user land is 32bit, each process can't grow beyond 4GB. If you remember...this is why 36bit experiment of Intel failed miserably 


> Neways I hope the thumb rule will be eliminated in future 32 bit Linuxes and I wonder if they are having trouble with 32 bit, then how'll they manage 64 bit and how'll they partition the exabytes!!


 When we will near exabytes, I am sure we will know about the limitations and they will be dealt with accordingly


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## mediator (Oct 25, 2006)

Still a confusion! Can't the Linux kernel on 32 bit machine access the whole 4 GB RAM with patches already applied??


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## eddie (Oct 25, 2006)

Ofcourse it can!!! That is the whole point of applying the patches but when we talk about a choice between staying with "32bit system + HIGHMEM patches" and 64bit system...moving to 64bit is advisable.


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## mehulved (Oct 25, 2006)

Eddie can you provide some links on this stuff, if you have some handy. I do understand part of it cos I have come across it while compiling a kernel. But still a major part of the explaination is unclear to me. If you can direct me to some resources that explain this, that would be great.


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## eddie (Oct 25, 2006)

Actually I saw this discussion happening some months back on gentoo-user mailing list. At that time there were links to lkml archives and detailed explanations but I am somehow not able to find those mails. May be you can search lkml and gentoo-user archives?


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## savithk (Oct 25, 2006)

i have a Q if i install 64bit linux . can i install 32bit linux software in 64bit linux. any linux64 is available on single CD.????


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## mediator (Oct 25, 2006)

@eddie, ok i got it! The 4GB memory can be accessed entirely in 32 bit now, and *for greater than 4GB "32 bit+highmem patches" also work*! Am i correct?


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## mehulved (Oct 25, 2006)

savithk said:
			
		

> i have a Q if i install 64bit linux . can i install 32bit linux software in 64bit linux. any linux64 is available on single CD.????


Well as per what's the discussion's going on you'd be better off using a 32-bit Linux. I can't explain you why, so well cos I personally don't have it clear in my mind.
But you'd save yourself a whole load of trouble if you go for a 32 bit linux for now. No real need to upgrade the RAM or anything.
Yes 64 bit linux distros are available in CD's. Well to be frank, a distro that comes in a CD is too minimalistic. If you can get some DVD that would be real great. Or multiple cd's.
A single cd of ubuntu linux for 64-bit platform can be delivered to your house free of cost in about a month's time from shipit.ubuntu.com



			
				eddie said:
			
		

> Actually I saw this discussion happening some months back on gentoo-user mailing list. At that time there were links to lkml archives and detailed explanations but I am somehow not able to find those mails. May be you can search lkml and gentoo-user archives?


Hmm all right will search for it in free time. Maybe subscribe to gentoo-user mailing list too after the exams.



			
				mediator said:
			
		

> @eddie, ok i got it! The 4GB memory can be accessed entirely in 32 bit now, and *for greater than 4GB "32 bit+highmem patches" also work*! Am i correct?


If I get it right, highmem can break a few things. Is it?
BTW, Highmem is a patch? Cos I have seen 'highmem' option while compiling the kernel, in it's description it says something like, to be used only if RAM is > 1GB.


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## savithk (Oct 25, 2006)

i know that linux is available in multiple cd's .....i mean is available in single CD only ???? or which is better CD or DVD. single CD is a ( live CD installer )??????but what about DVD also live installer.


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## JGuru (Oct 25, 2006)

@Savithk, It' better that you go for 32-bit version of Linux. Try installing *Suse 10.1 DVD* (32-bit).
 DVD is always better, no one wants to change CDs in between installation.
 So go ahead with Suse 10.1 Linux installation. I'm sure you'll like it very much.
 As far as the partitioning the disk is concerned, have atleast 10 GB of unpartitioned
 space, during partitioning choose the option "Allocate from the free space available"
 Suse Linux will automatically allocate the partitions for you. Or if you want to
 manually partition the hard disk, allocate 9 GB for root ('/') & 1.5 GB for swap.


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## savithk (Oct 26, 2006)

how to install Ubuntu linux . C ( winXp ) /D/E/F all drive in NTFS.how to make dual boot(XP+Linux). i have 512 MB it is ok for linux64 ???? or it should be 1GB. and how to remove linux ???


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## eddie (Oct 26, 2006)

mediator said:
			
		

> @eddie, ok i got it! The 4GB memory can be accessed entirely in 32 bit now, and *for greater than 4GB "32 bit+highmem patches" also work*! Am i correct?


 Yeah you got it more or less 
In simple words, if you have anything above 1GB RAM you need 4GB HIGHMEM option enabled...anything above 4GB RAM needs 64GB HIGHMEM option enabled.
__________


			
				tech_your_future said:
			
		

> BTW, Highmem is a patch? Cos I have seen 'highmem' option while compiling the kernel, in it's description it says something like, to be used only if RAM is > 1GB.


 It was developed as individual patch and then imported in official Kernel as an option.


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## savithk (Oct 26, 2006)

how to install Ubuntu linux . C ( winXp ) /D/E/F all drive in NTFS.how to make dual boot(XP+Linux). and how to remove linux ???


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## gary4gar (Oct 26, 2006)

u need to create root(/) a ext3 partion of atleast 10gb & a swap partion of twice sixe of ur ram something like pagefile in windows.
 u can use any tools like gparted or partion magic or inbuilt installer can also do this.

linux installion is little bit same as u would install windows. so if u know windows u can install linux also.


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## mediator (Oct 26, 2006)

@eddie : Hmmmm......nice! Neways thanx for the enlightenment!


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## praka123 (Oct 27, 2006)

regarding multimedia,flash etc install i saw a neat howto for 64's..
*www.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=202537


> This howto is not going to be a copy of the old one but will be updated. The old one was for Breezy and a lot has changed since Dapper was released. I have also tested this script with Edgy Knot 2 & 3 and have found no problems. The old one was "Firefox 1.5 with Flash and Java working 100% in amd64" howto by kurushi.
> I do not recommend Swiftfox. The person who compiles it takes the FOSS Firefox code, then restricts other people from distributing it. This IMHO is perverting the license.
> 
> Well enough chatter, on to the howto *ubuntuforums.org/images/smilies/icon_biggrin.gif


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## savithk (Oct 27, 2006)

how to edit boot log for xp / linux ??????? after linux install how can i boot xp????


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## JGuru (Oct 27, 2006)

You are talking about Ubuntu? You'll  get a boot menu, choose Ubuntu (default) or Windows
 using the arrow keys (Up, Down). Press the Enter key to load the O.S you have selected.
 This works the same in all Linux distros. In Linux ,GRUB is usually the bootloader.


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