# Kit lens replacement for Canon 600D - urgent



## aadi007 (Sep 9, 2015)

Hi All,

I have been dormant in this forum for a long time.
I have a Canon 600D and I am looking for a substitute for my kit lens.

Can you please help me decide between the following lenses - 

1> Tamron 17-50 2.8 Non VC - new 23K, used 15K
2> Tamron 17-50 2.8 VC - new 33K, used 22K
3> Sigma 17-50 2.8 OS HSM - new 32K, used 23K


I will be using the lens for indoor photography, portraits and landscapes. It will stay on my camera for most of the times..

I played around with the Sigma 17-50 OS but the autofocus seems wrong for most pictures. The reviews in internet say that this is the best lens in this budget and zoom range.

I also played with the Tamron Non VC and found it to be quite good.
What I am not sure about is whether I need OS/VC/IS at this zoom range. If not, I will just buy the Tammy 17-50 Non VC and save some money

It's kind of urgent as I need to buy one before I go out for a vacation in a couple of weeks.

Thanks...


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## sujoyp (Sep 9, 2015)

Bro just go with Tamron 17-50 2.8 Non VC ....that those wide focal length VR/VC is not that useful...
I have no issue using this lens for last 3 years ...and its my most used lens 

if you have heard the logic behind having a sharp pic, thats shutter speed should be twice of the focal length ...by that logic the shutter speed on this lens is very achivable as its a f2.8 lens  no VR/VC needed.


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## aadi007 (Sep 9, 2015)

Thanks Sujoy.. I guess you don't smoke and have steady hands. 
I am not so sure about myself.

Till what shutter speed you can go with the Tamron and still get sharp pics?
Do you find any problems with autofocus?
I understand that it's noisy but is it fast and accurate?

Can you post some photos in low light or typical indoor light?
Do you have any experience with The Tamron VC one or the Sigma OS?
I am hearing not so good things about the tamron VC.


Basic question regarding the importance of IS.
Say shooting with tamron at 50mm with F2.8, shutter speed 1/120
Now with kit lens, 50 mm will be F5.6, if I do shutter speed of 1/30 (it has IS), I get the same amount of light. So, what's the advantage of the Tamron?
What am I missing here?


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## nac (Sep 9, 2015)

aadi007 said:


> Basic question regarding the importance of IS.
> Say shooting with tamron at 50mm with F2.8, shutter speed 1/120
> Now with kit lens, 50 mm will be F5.6, if I do shutter speed of 1/30 (it has IS), I get the same amount of light. So, what's the advantage of the Tamron?
> What am I missing here?


That's a nice question. My perspective here is,
- With Tamron you have an option to shoot @ faster shutter speed. (Fast shutter is also used to freeze the action)
- I guess Tamron's optics quality is better than kit lens of Canon.
- Shallow depth of field

I am sure dslr users will shed more light on this.

BTW, If "IS" is the only thing, Canon claims 4 stops. So you can even go slower than 1/30


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## sujoyp (Sep 9, 2015)

I can shoot sharp pics till 1/20 with non VC 
there is no problem at all with AF...it works great and faster then kit 18-55

I have no experience with VC or OS 17-50...they say tammy non vc 17-50 is sharper then vc one.

the example you took is sort of ideal condition...take other example...suppose with tammy 50mm 2.8 you get 1/50 and with kit 50mm f5.6 you get 1/8 with IS ...the IS wont help here cause you cant keep the hands steady for so slow speed...and you will have to bump up the ISO to compensate that


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## aadi007 (Sep 9, 2015)

Thanks all..

I guess the faster lens has a big advantage in case we are shooting moving objects like people.
But when objects are stationary, the IS lens with a smaller aperture can match the faster lens.

Obviously, having both gives you lot more flexibility.
That's why, I was interested in the Sigma 17-50 and Tamron 17-50 VC lens.

The Tamron 17-50 VC did not feel good in hand, the zoom ring is very stiff as well.
The Sigma 17-50 OS has outstanding reviews and is considered the best budget lens in this segment by many.
As per many reviews and Dxomark, it beats the much more expensive Canon 17-55 2.8 IS lens.

That's why all the confusion.
Right now, it's between the Sigma and tamron non VC one.

Sujoy, 
Does the lens perform well at all focal lengths at 2.8?
Also, how is the optical quality compared to the kit lens?
And as far as I know, the IS is there to address the hand shaking problem ..isn't it?
Now, how effective the IS is in this range is questionable.
As per tests, the IS effectively allows 2 stops at 17 mm and 3 stops at 50 mm. Pretty significant as per me.

One more question - do you think the used lens makes sense? I have mentioned the prices in my original post.


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## sujoyp (Sep 10, 2015)

I am no expert to tell you how it performs ...but I can tell you that at 2.8 its definitely bit soft...but its there to shoot at low light 
optically its much better then kit.
IS is there for slight hand shake causing due to shutter speed...if you keep shutter speed above 1/100 then no IS needed
with 2 stop IS I think you may be able to shoot at 1/10 at 17mm


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## Cyrus_the_virus (Sep 10, 2015)

Watch the reviews by christopher frost photography. He has the best lens reviews on YouTube


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## aadi007 (Sep 11, 2015)

I saw his review and he is recommending the Sigma 17-50 OS HSM lens.
In fact, everyone is recommending that one even above the more costly Canon 17-55 F2.8.

Only thing is that when I tested it, the autofocus was not great.
So, I am confused.

- - - Updated - - -

95% I am going with Tamron Non VC.
What do you suggest - new or used lens? New is 22K and used is 15K in good condition - 2 years old.

Also, suggest a cheap & best tripod. I have no funda about tripod.


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## nac (Sep 11, 2015)

If you're buying used, check thoroughly.
Sujoy bought his used. He has first hand experience in buying used esp. Tamron 17-50 Non VC.

About tripod, don't go for "cheap". Even if you have to wait to save enough money to get a good tripod, WAIT.


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## aadi007 (Sep 12, 2015)

I am thinking about following tripods - 
Benro 600/660/800/880.
Vanguard 203AP, 203AGH.

I do not plan to buy a full frame camera any time soon.
My heaviest lens would be something like what I am considering now, max 500-700 gms.

So, all these have  weight bearing rating of 3KG.
So, I should be good.

from the reviews, it seems Vanguard will be a better choice. Please suggest.


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## Cyrus_the_virus (Sep 12, 2015)

aadi007 said:


> I am thinking about following tripods -
> Benro 600/660/800/880.
> Vanguard 203AP, 203AGH.
> 
> ...


I had a benro 660ex.. The legs start bowing after a couple of months. Fortunately or unfortunately I lost it in a mall.. An excuse to buy a better one


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## aadi007 (Sep 12, 2015)

hmm..so shall I go for the Vanguard ones?
I see Sujoy got that.

Sujoy bro, where are you ?????????????


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## nac (Sep 12, 2015)

aadi007 said:


> So, all these have  weight bearing rating of 3KG.
> So, I should be good.


Even simpex 333's load capacity is 3kg  don't go by that. It's better to go with some in depth reviews and first hand experience of a long time user/who knows a lot about tripods.

I have been thinking of buying a tripod for a very long time. But this video made me not to go for a cheapo one. Please note, I am using a "compact camera".


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## aadi007 (Sep 12, 2015)

[MENTION=125321]nac[/MENTION] - I do understand that.
I am hoping I will be able to buy something decent within 3-4K.
Or, is that not possible.

What's the minimum I need to spend to get a decent and safe tripod?
Please suggest.

As I said, I will have my Canon 600D + tamron 17-50. I don't think I will have more than this weight.


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## sujoyp (Sep 12, 2015)

what I can say is my Vanguard 203 AP cant handle D7000+Tamron 17-50 2.8 ...the head bends down...very frustating ...the combo is almost 1.5 kg ...

your combo is slightly lighter.

people say get right tripod first time...but really tripods r not cheap with ball head and good weight capacity...I will check and get back to you....till then you can look for a tripod which can handle 5kg and have ball head


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## aadi007 (Sep 12, 2015)

I just ended up buying the lens which I discarded - Tamron 17-50 VC 
Sparingly used one - with marumi UV filter and lens hood @22K.

I spent more than 1 hour in the shop with 3 lenses
Sigma 17-50 OS
Tamron 17-50 Non VC
Tamron 17-50 VC

The Sigma was out as the autofocussing was incorrect most of the times.

Both the Tamron lenses focused correctly. The VC lens was quieter and slightly faster I feel.
Both have very good image quality (I took more than 50 shots in different lighting conditions)
- the sharpness is identical at center at less. May be corners the Non VC is better but I couldn't notice much difference in image quality.

But indoors, I could clearly see the VC lens having an advantage as it allowed shutter speeds up to 1/10,1/15 secs without any shake/blur.

I also checked lots of tripods but did not buy any as I though I should do more research before buying as there are lot of things to understand.


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## nac (Sep 12, 2015)

Congrats Aadi. So we can expect some photos with 600D and 17-50 combo soon???


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## sujoyp (Sep 12, 2015)

congrats aadi


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## aadi007 (Sep 13, 2015)

Guyz, I am okay with the technical aspects but poor from a creative aspect.
So I will need some inputs from you for everyday photography.

Will be posting some pics in the photography thread shortly.


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