# The key to success : Education or Skills



## gxsaurav (Feb 19, 2007)

For me it's Skills, education does helps in refining what u already got. but education doesn't makes you what you are. Once the education of school college or university ends, you are on your own & its the skills which makes u something in life.

I see IIT & MBAs doing nothing....cos they don't have skills,....yet i see polytecnique students doing big cos they have skills.

What do u believe in?


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## S_P (Feb 19, 2007)

For me both, tell me when would you get better job ? big companies always ask for good resumes i.e good qualification no matter how bad you are in your field but if u scored good marks then they will appoint you rather than the boy who knows much better than you but having no qualification. because he/she wont attend the interviews just because of this qualification, because i have seen so many peoples working in a small shops or small garages but they have good knowledge of the field they are working in rather than the person holding a degree certificate, i am not saying that this is for all , i know there are much better engineers too.

so for me  education + skills = success ...!! Cheers..
__________
and you should have add one more option too.. "Both "


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## cvvikram (Feb 19, 2007)

I think there should have been option called 'Both' in the poll.

For me both are equally important.


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## djmykey (Feb 19, 2007)

I guess its both, coz if you dont have the skills and only the education (like me) u r looked down upon. And if u have the skills but no education then they dont wanna hear from you. Unless u have someone in the company who will give u a good recommendation. Ok and just in case you get recruited, you wont get the post according to the work you do. I mean they do take you, but u dont get the designation that you deserve. So all in all its not worth a shot if u know everything. U shud get education & certificates.


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## gxsaurav (Feb 19, 2007)

Wops, forgot the option for "Both".Mod can u plz fixe it now


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## n2casey (Feb 19, 2007)

For me both r equally needed or *education : skills :: 40% : 60%*.
Mods plz provide an option for both in poll.


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## cyborg47 (Feb 19, 2007)

both are important, but skills first.


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## Aberforth (Feb 19, 2007)

Education is important to give you a finer outlok of life but the kind of knowledge based exam centric education in India even upto Ph.D level does little in the name of education. Even at IIT and management institutes despite all claims, creativity and ideas are given little credance by most professors and rote learning for 'exam prepapration' and 'scrores' are preferred. Mere skills don't help much as growth is hampered, education equips us with the tools for further learning and enhancing of skills. What we need is a revamping of cirricula to ensure a skill and reality based education instead of the assembly line one of current. I know it would take a lot of difficulty happening if not impossible, we have bureaucracy and resistence to change in all levels.




			
				gx_saurav said:
			
		

> I see IIT & MBAs doing nothing....cos they don't have skills,....yet i see polytecnique students doing big cos they have skills.



They do help. IIT, the portal of science contributes big way to finance and banking companies. MBA teach you a lot how to be a good wage earner employee of some big corporates with the blood sucking work and big pay packages. *sarcastic*


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## mail2and (Feb 19, 2007)

IITians don't have 'skills'? :sigh: They're one of the most brilliant people I have ever met.

In a lot of cases, education gives you skills, which are required to be successful.  Education will give you all skills necessary to excel in life, provided the place where you study is good enough. Any IIT or IIM graduate or for that matter any person from a top 100 engineering istitute and a top 50 management institute will have the skills to be successful in life.

Instead of 'skills', I would say the attitude towards work is more important to be successful. Are you willing to work hard? Are you open to criticism? Do you have a clear conscience?

I'll tell you a true story of two people. One passed out from IIM-A, and even know, is brilliant. The kind of work he can do is just amazing.

Then there was this other guy. He passed out from probably the worst university in India. He had lesser skills than what the IIM guy had.

The IIM grad got a huge first salary, while the other guy got nothing.

Today, the IIM grad is sitting at home unemployed, whereas the other guy is one of the most known persons in international banking circles. 

The reason for this? The other guy worked hard, improved his skills, was open to criticism, and did not take the short cut by lying; while the IIM grad was arrogant, he had bad relations with his subordinates, and wasn't open to criticizm.

So, it's more a question of aptitude towards work rather than skills.


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## Pathik (Feb 19, 2007)

to get a chance to prove ur skills... u need education...
otherwise


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## piyush gupta (Feb 19, 2007)

Both are important

*If u dont have education how u got skills

if u dont what skills what u educated*


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## shashank4u (Feb 19, 2007)

they r interlinked ..
u ve to be educated if want to be
specialized in some field..
skill comes with knowledge and knowledge comes with education..


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## Aberforth (Feb 19, 2007)

You cannot always connect education with skills though, at least in India. I have come across master degree holders from top universities with little employable skills. According to a recent newspaper report too..a large number of engineers in India are unemployable.


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## gxsaurav (Feb 19, 2007)

good, so far skills are exceling. So there are indeed more believeres in skills then education. Will reply to this thread soon, busy right now

P.S. : Mods plz update the Poll


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## rakeshishere (Feb 19, 2007)

My vote for skills as Nowadays People with higher and higher degrees r jst doin nothin as they lack skills


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## praka123 (Feb 19, 2007)

*where is your BE degree?F*** off,never come in my way*

you need a degree for proving ur skills! that is the hard reality.i am saying this wr.to IT industry;for other also it may be true.if u r a guy who's got only 8 more arrears to clear for BE,got the talent-then also u r chances are locked.bcoz the employer for sure will put a roadblock on your options-BE/MCA graduates needed.and u simply cant approach isnt it?.

I think those who are talented in say graphics work etc...should come foreward to form a freelancer club.
I hope,In west Degree is not a stumbling block for ur job,i suppose :~


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## mail2and (Feb 19, 2007)

Aberforth said:
			
		

> You cannot always connect education with skills though, at least in India. I have come across master degree holders from top universities with little employable skills. According to a recent newspaper report too..a large number of engineers in India are unemployable.



Very true. Sourabh on this forum studies in the city's best engineering college. Ask him about some of the students studying at VJTI. 

It's also true in the case of other countries, too. For example, UK has very good universities. However, universities outside of the top 30 in the UK are bad.

Dhirubhai Ambani had neither education nor skill. All he had was the resolve to work hard and a good eye.

It's not between education and skills. It's rather a matter of aptitude toward work.


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## phreak0ut (Feb 19, 2007)

Both are important. It is relative.


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## freebird (Feb 19, 2007)

someone here in the forum who's proof of skills are the key to success.
most prolly self-employed...


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## Aberforth (Feb 19, 2007)

mail2and said:
			
		

> Ask him about some students studying at VJTI.



Sure I would, I need the link to his profile. You can send it through PM if you want.

I had classmates who are extremely arrogant and proud of being where they are. Kind of elitism without the substance or personality to back it up, most of them are simply nerds and got placed in companies who care for only their ability to work hard and crunch numbers.

I considered going for software for my masters but changed mind halfway after I came across experiences of a few classmates placed in a software company. It was good I took a year off to look around and as a break, I consider having made the best decision to be where I am, now.



			
				mail2and said:
			
		

> It's also true in the case of other countries, too. For example, UK has very good universities. However, universities outside of the top 30 in the UK are bad.



UK has some of the best universities in the world like UoL, Leeds, Oxford, Cambridge, Edinburg, Glasgow and other 5 or 4 1/2 star rated ones and they are better than Indian ones several times over for their focus on research, industry collaboration, teaching environment and best of all - opportunities. We need such quality control from independent bodies in India instead of relying on brand names and top placement salaries alone which focus skin deep issues. How many Indian universities are in top world rankings, even the IITs?


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## mail2and (Feb 19, 2007)

Aberforth said:
			
		

> UK has some of the best universities in the world like UoL, Leeds, Oxford, Cambridge, Edinburg, Glasgow and other 5 or 4 1/2 star rated ones and they are better than Indian ones several times over for their focus on research, industry collaboration, teaching environment and best of all - opportunities. (



Actually, in the case of B-schools, Indian schools are right up there with the best. I would take world rankings with a grain of salt. They have indicators like diversity of students, alumni effectiveness,  work experience etc. 

I have admits from Cranfield, Cass, Lancaster and Edinburgh for MSc Finance. According to The Economist, Cranfield is  the 19th best B-school in the world, with the rest of the three being in the top 50.

However, the director of MSc programs at a top UK univ himself agreed that the grads from IIMs are much better than that of any UK business school, with the exception of London Business School. Oxford(Said), Cambridge(Judge) and Cranfield might have fancy names, but their MBA grads are not better than those from the IIMs.

As for opportunities, the top 20 schools here get 100% placement(almost). In the UK, getting a job after MBA with less work experience is almost next to impossible. 

Research wise the UK univs are better, as they charge a huge amount as fees. They do get grants from the government, but they charge huge amounts from international students to make up a large part of their requirements.

But, all in all, I would settle for a top 10 Indian b-school admit than say Cranfield, Cass or even LSE.


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## Aberforth (Feb 19, 2007)

Well mail2and, There is one thing which counts is international exposure and interaction between people of so many races which is not much in India, even at IIMs. IIMs are better because of their extreme competition which makes only the best of the best get in. Compare the competition to that of INSEAD, LSB and you get the picture. Its peanuts to get into them (with a year or more of work experience or break), only problems for Indians comes is astronomical fees. It is more because of the students than IIMs themselves..

Same goes for IITs they are more of teaching colleges than real tech. insititues. Research is concentrated on a few top professors and except Spic Macay and other exhibs, little credance is given to creativity. Learn to ride bicycle by reading books, more like. Compare that to UoL's Imperial College, Glasgow or Edinburgh and you get the picture. No wonder we see investment bankers and software coders instead of scientists from IITs.


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## s18000rpm (Feb 19, 2007)

for me both are InterConnected.


With Education you can improve your Skill

i'm an Mechanical Engineer,  i'm was able to troubleshoot many of the Mecahnical related problems (very basic ones) in Engines, GearBox... when i was a 1st year student (now thats Skill), but after completing Engineering, i'm able to troubleshoot (that is pin point the problem & resolve it) quickly &  Professionally   (this is thanks to the Education  )


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## mail2and (Feb 19, 2007)

Aberforth said:
			
		

> No wonder we see investment bankers and software coders instead of scientists from IITs.



I completely agree with you on this.

The recent trend is even more disturbing. A lot of IITians are ending up in Canary Wharf and on Wall Steet as front office traders for the BB firms, while they should be doing research.

But, I guess it is because research doesn't pay that much in India. ISRO has a pay scale of 10000-200-13000 per month, I think! Compare that to £5000 per month that an IITian can get within an year in an investment bank as an analyst. And then there are golden handshake bonuses.


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## Aberforth (Feb 19, 2007)

mail2and said:
			
		

> But, I guess it is because research doesn't pay that much in India. ISRO has a pay scale of 10000-200-13000 per month, I think! Compare that to £5000 per month that an IITian can get within an year in an investment bank as an analyst. And then there are golden handshake bonuses.



Compare that with the Rs. 10000 - 12000 a research assistant gets at an IIT or the Rs. 25000 for IIT professors (after masters and Ph.Ds with 9+ GPAs) with 20 years of experience get and I often think I can't blame their lack of humour. Well we're getting off topic and I think we can continue discussing in PMs if required. Don't want IITs suing me for defamation.


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## mail2and (Feb 19, 2007)

Aberforth said:
			
		

> Rs. 25000 for IIT professors (after masters and Ph.Ds with 9+ GPAs)



*faints*


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## mediator (Feb 19, 2007)

To excel in something u need to learn the "how" of it! The first question is always "how"! After that its just ur natural thinking that takes over it and tries to explore different ways in it! It is called "refinement" and then the person is called "talented"!


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## hailgautam (Feb 21, 2007)

Both skill and education is required. without education you will not get a chance to show your skill and then you loose on the opportunities.


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